Should Lesbian marriage be legalised?

[David Black]

Two British women who were married in Canada have gone to the High Court in a test case to win legal recognition for same-sex couples who marry abroad.

The University professors Sue Wilkinson and Celia Kitzinger, who live in north Yorkshire, argue that UK laws which validated their union as a "civil partnership" do not go far enough.

I saw this today in the paper and thought how the world was so much simpler in the 1960s and 70s.

Do you approve of gay marriages? I mean on an equal footing to normal marriage?

[Lonnie]

Afraid i'm going to put a few backs up here, but first, I have nothing against Gay or Lesbian relationships, but I do not believe they should get married.

I know we live in the 21st century, but to me, marriage is primarily there to give children a secure base, with a mother and father, and I do not believe Gay or Lesbian couples should raise children, which, if they are allowed to get married, will probably be the next step.

I know, from what i've posted, there are lots af variables, and its wide open to critisisms, But, that is my view, and I expect that to be respected, as I respect the views already posted.

[Pippa68]

I totally respect your view Lonnie :o) however, I am pretty sure that gay people will become parents if they want to even without being able to become legally married..

Straight couples do it all the time ~ either for a short while before splitting up, or eventually getting married, or for a long while & never tying the knot. This is a choice straight couples can make ~ unfortunately gay couples don't have the choice.

I am sure that the majority of gay couples are content with the civil partnership though..but we will wait and see!

[sp1814]

Lonnie

If a straight couple cannot have kids or chose not to, should they also be prevented from marrying?

By the way, I actually agree with part of your sentiments, that having a mum and dad who are married and committed to each other is a very good thing...but gay couples can also have kids. Shouldn't these couples also be able to raise their kids in a married environment?

Again...not having a go - just discussing.

[sp1814]

Lonnie - by the way, the way you expressed your honestly held views shouldn't get anyone's backs up. Whilst I 100% disagree with you, you've managed to make your point without being offensive or rude.

[gessoo]

Lonnie, I do respect your views, but when I got married I had no intention of having children. In fact I definitely thought I didn't want any. I got married for the reasons mentioned in my post above.

I cannot see a problem with gay couples raising children. Above all children need a secure loving enironment and whether it be a single person, a hetrosexual couple or a gay couple as long as the parent/parents are totally commited to giving the children the best possible upbringing then I don't see the problem........

[gessoo]

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,If the gay parents love each other and respect each other than the children will be happy. Better gay parents than hetrosexual parents in an unhappy relationship.

(PS I did go on to have a child and am really glad I did!)

Had to post in two parts due to AB problems!!! grrr

[Clanad]

Part 1.
Call me purblind, but I think there�s a point to be made that many are overlooking. All laws like it or not, have, at their most basic level, an underlying of morality. When sanctioned or prohibited by society through the State, laws, such as those governing marriage, a fundamental (no pun intended) purpose of imposing such morality on that society. The result is a stabilized norm that has, over eons of civilization, found to be best for mankind. When the paradigm is dramatically altered, the far reaching effects on society are often overlooked due to the short term expediency of �feel-goodism�.

[Clanad]

Part 2.
If the State�s imprimatur on laws governing marriage are changed to allow same sex marriage, why wouldn�t/shouldn�t society sanction marriage of more than 2 people (polygamy) or the marriage of a person and their pet dog or horse, or the marriage of brother and sister? Outrageous, you say? Why? Wouldn�t the denial of such �civil rights� be illegal in light of this considered change? Wouldn�t anyone protesting those actions as outrageous against society be seen as a bigot? Then, would one say, with a straight face, that such actions wouldn�t have an affect on their own marriage, let alone society, at large? Such proposals would only be a matter of time� in my opinion�

[*ALFIE*]

I love lesbians

[Pippa68]

Come again?

[Lonnie]

As I intimated, my arguements/views have holes that a horse and cart could be driven into, and some of you have, thats fair, and thanks for the civilised responses.

I just think, and you can call me old fashioned if you like, that having two mummies, or two daddies, is not a sound base to bring up children.

I appreciate, understand the views put forward, and am grateful for the way you've responded to my answer.

Maybe in another thread, i'll go into it a lot more deeply, but please be aware, i'm not trying to upset anyone, just put my views accross.

[gessoo]

Wouldn't it be nice Lonnie if discussion like this could take place all the time on AB. We should all be able to listen to other people's points of view - unfortunately it's so easy to remain blinkered. I admit to it myself sometimes. My husband shares your views by the way and we often have 'discussions' about it - sometimes they do get a little heated to say the least!

Two mummies or two daddies may not be perfect but is becoming more common and acceptable. Let's face it so many children have such a raw deal that if they are loved and nurtured and given security then it can't be frowned upon.

[Pippa68]

Well said Lonnie & gessoo.

It's great to have a healthy debate without nastiness ~ all views are welcome :o)

[JudgeJ]

I�ve no real views on this. I don�t really care what people get up to as long as I am not forced to watch it or pay for it. However, I would make the following observations:

Just because lots of people indulge in something that, by itself, does not mean that special legislation should be passed to accommodate it. On the contrary, there are often very good reasons to legislate against some practices which may be acceptable elsewhere. A couple of examples I can think of immediately are bigamy and the stoning to death of adulterous women.

Much has been made in these postings of gay couples �having� children. Gay couples cannot have children. The best they can do is to either raise children conceived and born to a straight couple, or one of them can be a step parent to the other�s children. This latter option must involve a third party of the opposite sex to the gay couple donating either the appropriate ingredients or the finished product. Sorry, boys and girls, but there it is. No amount of legislation or thought engineering will alter that.

It was on this basis that the institution of marriage was founded � a father and a mother conceiving, bearing and raising children. Of course other types of relationship can be just as committed and loving and deep and meaningful. In many cases they are more so than some �conventional� relationships. But they cannot be marriages.

[sp1814]

JudgeJ

I take on board your views, but honestly, I know that I could 'have' kids, even if it weren't in the traditional sense (a mum and dad living at home).

I honestly think that within the next 30 years or so, 'gayness' will not be seen as 'different'. It will eventually become quite boring..."so you're gay...so what?"

I really understand where you're coming from, but I totally disagee with you with respect to the reason why people of all sexualities should be given the opportunity to express their love in public.

This is so weird...having a non-agressive discussion on the News section.

C'mon someone...say something offensive. We're up to post 35 now, and no-one has been derogatory.

It's almost scary.

[JudgeJ]

Oh alright then:

Homosexuality is already boring. Why anyone should be interested in their sordid shenanigans I really don�t know.

Quite why they should expect the laws of the country to be changed to accommodate their nefarious practices is beyond me.

There�s nothing stopping them expressing their love in public � I just don�t think they should be allowed to get married.

Will that do?!?!?!?!?

[WaldoMcFroog]

Of course homosexuality's boring. It's no more intrinistically interesting than hetero, which is why many people can't understand others getting so worked up about it.

A serious point, not intended to get salacious. What's especially sordid about homosexual relationships?

There's very little what they get up to that couldn't be achieved by a happily married couple with kids. I hope I don't get censored for this, but here goes. Anal sex (as probably the 'main' act one might associate with gay men) is part of a normal sexual relationship for many straight couples now.

You can find it sordid, if you must, but I don't see it's particularly got anything to do with homosexuality.

[Pippa68]

Hmm I dunno Judge ~ it really depends on what kind of love they want to express in public ;o)

But of course I am not excluding straight couples in this instance!

[*ALFIE*]

i would love to make out with a lesbian

[dave2222]

i cant believe anyone can think its ok its sickening to think u can bring kids up round this