OK TO KILL GENTILES

[Cugetit]

A West Bank rabbi has written a book that says Jews can kill non-Jews who threaten Israel.
Shapira, head of the Od Yosef Chai Yeshiva, also said in "The King's Torah" that it is permissible to kill children if they pose a threat. Rabbi Yitzhak Shapira of the West Bank settlement of Yitzhar released the book Monday. When is the world going to wake up? Not a question for Lonnie.

[Sandy-Wroe]

Think back to the murderous assault on the people of Gaza at the beginning of the year. While it was going on the western leaders were conspicuous by their silence. That refusal to call on Israel to stop the killing of innocent civilians was actually a tacit endorsement of the butchery.
So, it comes as no surprise to me that a Rabbi should hold views that one section of humanity is something less than human and even children are legitimate targets.
That philosophy has a familiar ring to it. Germany in the 1930's. It's ironic that Zionists have adopted so many of the beliefs of the people who once persecuted their grandfathers.

[ABerrant]

Sandy-Wroe... you write of the irony that "Zionists have adopted so many of the beliefs of the people who once persecuted their grandfathers" as if it is a relatively recent turnabout but the fact is that during the 1930s Zionists (such as the Revisionists) were themselves engaging in fascist acts. To some degree Fascism has always been present within the State of Israel.

[Raleigh]

And how high a circulation is this book going to have? Unlike the widely circulated Koran that states that it is permissible to kill ALL jews and other non-believers whether they are a threat or not.

[keyplus90]

Raleigh- And where exactly it is written in Koran as you have mentioned?

[Raleigh]

keyplus90 - I am repeating what has been stated on the internet, in newspapers and on radio and tv programmes over the last few years. When this subject arises there are always those who claim it does not say such a thing and it is a mistranslation. Is there a definative translation, or do followers of Islam in some countries interprate it as they see fit?
Is this rabbi's book written in English or Hebrew? Maybe it is being mistranslated.
But I note that the accusation concerns those 'who threaten Israel' - not a blanket threat on a whole nation or people.

[Sandy-Wroe]

And how would a child in Gaza or the West Bank threaten Israel?

[R1Geezer]

Keyplus as usual denies his own disgusting religion:
"KORAN commands to kill infidels:

Allah is an enemy to unbelievers. - Sura 2:98

On unbelievers is the curse of Allah. - Sura 2:161

Slay them wherever ye find them and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. - 2:191"

I think that's pretty clear, are you now saying keyplus that the Koran does not guide Islam? I think yolu need to make uop your mind sunshine!

And before you chime in with the bibke etc etc, remember I am an atheist, to me all religion is evil, I use the word "evi"l so religous beleivers understand ok pedants!?

[Cugetit]

R1Geezer .... OK I think we know where your loyalties lie, having glossed over some of your past answers, but you will find nothing in the Quran which appears to make quite a statement. And, the idiot who wrote this book, I understand, works at one of the teaching establishments on a kibbutz in Israel. The state should never have been established in the first place. The world would have been a much more peaceful place now if it had never existed. If you ask "How many jews perished in the 'holocaust'?" there are quite a few people, I would guess, who would answer, "5 millions, give or take a thousand". Ask how many Catholics, Christians, Moslems, Hindus, etc etc died, out of a total of 55 millions and not many could profer an answer. Instead of kicking up a fuss about the possibility of Ahmadinajad acquiring a nuclear capability, maybe the answer is to supply him with the necessary know-how and fund it.!!! This is just an opinion, you should remember, also from a non-believer!!! Not only a non-believer but somebody who believes that 95 peer cent of the world's population are mentally retarded .......... the vast majority of those being the religious ones. Arrogant enough to claim to be in the 5 per cent. hth

[R1Geezer]

the bove are direct from the Koran, they are not my opinions.

[Raleigh]

'The state should never have been established in the first place. The world would have been a much more peaceful place now if it had never existed'

What a moronic statement.

Does anyone - except for idiots - think that all those peaceful, democrtaic and fun-loving people in the countries surrounding Israel are only acting aggresively to the west because of the state being there?

Think yourself lucky that there is a small buffer between the maniacs and the rest of Europe.

And since you raised the Holocaust again - maybe you could find another episode where a supposed civilised country attempted to murder an entire group of people who posed no threat to them. Doctors, teachers, shopkeepers, carpenters, bus drivers, women, children, babies - ordinary people - tortured and murdered in their millions for NO REASON EXCEPT HATE. Yeah, people like that get a bit angry and retaliate when their existance is threatened again.

[123everton]

History teaches us that a people without a country are ripe for abuse, the Jews needed a home land so that somebody could speak for them on the world stage. As to where that homeland should have been built is entirely another issue.
The man in question is probably a bit of a crank, but, his rhetoric is no more obnoxious than his rivals.
Simple question, imagine you are a soldier, a 12 year old girl with a load of semtex tied to her waist is running towards you screaming.
What ya gonna do?

[keyplus90]

My dear geezer-

Quran 2-98. Whoever is an enemy to Allah and His angels and apostles, to Gabriel and Michael,- Lo! Allah is an enemy to those who reject Faith.

Quran 2-161. Those who reject Faith, and die rejecting,- on them is Allah.s curse, and the curse of angels, and of all mankind;

Does it say that Muslims should kill All the Jews. You supplied half of the verses and even there I can’t see anything like that. Yes it says that Allah is the enemy or would curse them. So that is between Allah and the un-believers. Nothing to do with Muslims. As you do not believe in God, or Allah so you have nothing to worry about as for you nothing like that exist.

Quran 2-191. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.
Now these are war time verses to uplift the morale of handful people fighting three time more well equipped army of the people who oppressed, and drove them out of their homes and still came to kill them 375 miles away.

But I would have liked if you wouldn’t have done pick and choose yet once again and at least should have mentioned one verse before and after the one you mentioned. Here you go I would help you with that. Here is the one before that,

Quran 2-190. Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

And one after,

Quran 2-190. Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.

Finally I do not have to mention Bible as I have nothing to do with Bible.

[Lonnie]

Cugetit, we haven't always seen eye to eye, I believe there are cases for life to be taken, but I cannot agree with this person, he may as well join forces with the 'Mad Mullahs' of Islam.

There's no place for someone with his views.

[naomi24]

Madmen all!

[R1Geezer]

keyplus, you have been brainwashed mate, there's little point in me trying to get through.

[Ankou]

isn't it really just saying, sef defence is ok, provided they are not jews ?

[jake-the-peg]

"A West Bank rabbi has written a book "

Wow! so did Eric von Danekin

Here's just one refutation
http://www.angelfire.com/mt/talmud/kill.html

Anyone will tell you that I'm no fan of Israel's behaviour but seriously this is just a really crude rehashing of the old "blood libel"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_libel

They've ditched the Human sacrifice and put in the state of Israel but at the heart it's still "Jews Kill Children"

It's 2,000 year old for goodness sake - are people still falling for it?