Nazis or Germans

[modeller]

Have you noticed when the media talk about the war you would think we were never at war with the Germans only the Nazis. Whenever any violence is mentioned be it their treatment of the Jews, massacres, mass bombing, brutality etc . It is always the Nazis who did it , just as if the German Nation somehow were not involved.

[dothawkes31]

Isn't that something that is historically accurate then?

[Rev Sermon]

Be careful if your English as we live in a glass house. I seem to remember we were having pogroms against the Jews long before the Germans (I may be wrong but I believe one of the the first anti-semitic massacres on record was in York). We were also bombing civilians as much as the Germans in WWII.
Not going on a massive guilt trip and putting us down but really the average German no more wanted the war or the genocide than we did.

[craft1948]

Quite right there Rev.....which I think is why, even today, we have very few Jews in York.....

[dothawkes31]

My childrens great great grandmother was gernan from saxe coburg and came to england in 1879 to bake cakes but the english locked her in white city internment camp in 1915.

[modeller]

Quite right and that's my point the whole nation were involved and therefore when discussing these events the term German should be used not Nazis. There were a few exceptions such as the activities of the SS and the Gestapo who were dedicated Nazis but most of the war was carried out by the ordinary Germans. The truth of the matter is that as long as they were winning the Germans Nation supported their government and that fact should acknowledged by our media and not whitewashed out by using the term Nazis.

[Androcles]

Wasn't Hitler actually born an Austrian?

[dothawkes31]

No my childrens great great grandmother wasn't supporting anyone as they took away her livelyhood, luckily her daughter had already married William Hawkes and in the second world war she was a nurse working at the Isleworth hospital helping the victims of the blitz

[tiggerblue10]

There were some Germans who defected and came to the UK. They then fought the Nazi's.

[ll_billym]

Much as I dislike the media, I don't think it is as bad as you are saying it is. They refer to 'German bombers' and 'German troops', it is when they talk about concentration camps, rallies, regieme, etc. that Nazi is applied. I suppose that is because these occured as a result of Nazi Party doctrines, policies and laws even though German born people carried out the act.

[modeller]

What you say ll billym is partly correct but last week the term Nazis troops was used to describe the invasions of Russia and Europe and when you bear in mind less than 5% of the Germans were active members of the party that term is nonsense. I spent several years living with Germans many of whom were veterans but like us fought for their country but most were not Nazis.
Your comment Rev Sermon is interesting you appear to be saying that because there was anti semitism during the Middle Ages that that somehow excuses what happened in WW II. . On that basis the religious wars and the brutality of the Inquisition is also an excuse for what is happening in the world today.

[123everton]

Hitler was an Austrian but the Austrians are a Germanic people, be careful when you talk about Austria and this period as some wil try to tell you that they were the first victims of Hitler's expansionism, they weren't, the vast majority of Austrians supported the Anschluss, be very wary of modern Austrian and German victimology.
The Nazis overwhelmingly identified themselves with German culture, ergo to be a Nazi was to be German, there is a very unpalatable fact that modern Germans try hard to suppress, most of the atrocities committed during the war were committed by the Wehrmacht, not the S.S.
The S.S had specialised units and commands for killing people, the Wehrmacht just killed anyone.
For a quick reference look at the advance and retreat from Russia.

[anotheoldgit]

/// Nazis or Germans ///

What is the difference, we are constantly told that it is only a small percentage of Muslims that are "Militant Terrorists" and the rest are peace loving, who would never do us harm.

How do we know, which is which.

[TCL-MUMPING]

"What is the difference, we are constantly told that it is only a small percentage of Muslims that are "Militant Terrorists" and the rest are peace loving, who would never do us harm.

How do we know, which is which."

I'm sure Dr Shipman was thought of as a decent doctor until we found out he'd murdered hundreds more than any Muslim extremist has in this country but I'd still go to see my own doctor if need be.

[Snafu03]

I wouldnt get that hung up on it. There arent many European countries that havent had 'a difference of opinion' with the Jews which has led to their banishment.

[shaneystar2]

most of the atrocities committed during the war were committed by the Wehrmacht
Rubbish .
My father in law was in the Wehrmacht
The Wehrmacht just killed anyone .Nonsense .
Pa was a conscript like a lot of ordinary Germans and a man with a family who didn't want to go war .
The Wehrmacht were the domestic armed forces ( army ,navy and air force )and were in place long before the rise of the Nazi party ,the Nazi party just jumped on the bandwagon by forming their own SS de facto group and attaching themselves to the armed forces and then carrying out their horrible policies under that umbrella .
As for the retreat from Russia .You would have retreated if you were in ten foot of snow without even a coat and nearly having had your fingers frozen off .
Hitler thought so much of his troops he couldn't even supply them with basic clothing and armaments much like we are doing to our own troops today in Afghanistan
The Nazis were a political party who ruled the roost and the people had to obey .. I still have the Stammbuch where my husbands family had to prove they had no Jewish ancestry . .And to equate your normal German man with being a Nazi and Jew hater is not on .
As for the Germans today ..yes ..some feel guilty but then again who invented the concentration camp ?
Why should the younger generation feel guilty .My husband certainly doesn't although he has been made to feel as if he is over the many years he has lived here by intolerant bigoted people,who seem think that he alone is responsible for all the atrocities that happened during the war .And believe me some do !
As I have said before ,not all Germans are Nazis and not all Nazis are German .

[123everton]

Shaney, sorry but you're wrong, plainly and simply.
Hostage taking and executions were carried out by the Wehrmacht, several years ago a German museum put on a display showing the complicity of Wehrmacht troops in war crimes,
It caused a huge hue and cry, but, it was, however, true.

[bookbinder]

How much longer do the Germans have to keep on saying "Sorry"?

[tara20]

How much longer will the British gutter press insist on using 'Nazi' vocabulary every time anything German (like the disgusting Ballack affair about black football shirts) is mentioned? The majority of Germans now weren't even born till after the war.