ChatterBank0 min ago
Is it our fault?
75 Answers
http://tinyurl.com/6hs5oee
First we sent into Libya the SAS, to help out the rebels, only for them to be captured and then kicked out of the country, now we have situation were our aid workers were stuck in Tokyo airport and then they are sent home because they don't have the correct papers.
Mistakes have been made by our Foreign Office maybe, but our media can't wait to cry out for British blood, yes Haigh must go, the civil servants at the Foreign Office must be weeded out etc, etc. and just as some on AB.are always quick to point out, the Brits are the ones to blame.
Wouldn't it make a refreshing change , for the media to state that 'Johnny Foreigner' just does not want our 'proffered help' so s0d them, let them get on with it, and keep our resources for our own peoples?
First we sent into Libya the SAS, to help out the rebels, only for them to be captured and then kicked out of the country, now we have situation were our aid workers were stuck in Tokyo airport and then they are sent home because they don't have the correct papers.
Mistakes have been made by our Foreign Office maybe, but our media can't wait to cry out for British blood, yes Haigh must go, the civil servants at the Foreign Office must be weeded out etc, etc. and just as some on AB.are always quick to point out, the Brits are the ones to blame.
Wouldn't it make a refreshing change , for the media to state that 'Johnny Foreigner' just does not want our 'proffered help' so s0d them, let them get on with it, and keep our resources for our own peoples?
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If you made sure that you had your facts correct, AOG, some of us wouldn't have to risk your ire by pointing out truths...........
The aid-workers, who are an independent body from any 'offical' help the UK has sent, were turned back because they had failed to secure the necessary paperwork to enable them to buy large petrol supplies........which, naturally, is on ration at the moment.
Perhaps *because* there is so much chaos around at present the Japanese are insisting that all 'Ts are crossed and Is dotted' in order to prevent additional tangles ?
The aid-workers, who are an independent body from any 'offical' help the UK has sent, were turned back because they had failed to secure the necessary paperwork to enable them to buy large petrol supplies........which, naturally, is on ration at the moment.
Perhaps *because* there is so much chaos around at present the Japanese are insisting that all 'Ts are crossed and Is dotted' in order to prevent additional tangles ?
<<stead of them refusing them entry>>
That's a lie Old Git and you should know it.
The japanese have a perfectly good procedure to manage the chaos in their country and coordinate relief efforts from home and overseas.
Our people in japan failed to organise themselves - that was the problem. Other countries' teams have managed to comply.
Our 'diplomat' in Libya was in fact MI5. I suspect his mission was to further our interests more than altruistic.
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That's a lie Old Git and you should know it.
The japanese have a perfectly good procedure to manage the chaos in their country and coordinate relief efforts from home and overseas.
Our people in japan failed to organise themselves - that was the problem. Other countries' teams have managed to comply.
Our 'diplomat' in Libya was in fact MI5. I suspect his mission was to further our interests more than altruistic.
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I understood the Japanese authorities made it a condition that foreign aid workers would (a) have to integrate with the overall Japanese rescue plan, (b) would have to provide their own transport, and (c) would have to provide their own linguistic support. It seems IRC did not have any transport or Japanese speakers/translators and the Japanese authorities would not issue passes to get into exclusion zones until the FCO could confirm in writing that (b) and (c) were available.
If the old git had the sense to read his own link he'd understand the team were not refused entry into japan. The issue was the paperwork wasn't available to get them through roadblocks into disaster areas.
Old Git seems to imagine the japanese authorities should allow any bunch of people who turn up with torches and bag of tools to pile in and start digging in the debris. Heaven help us if he was ever in charge of anything significant.
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Old Git seems to imagine the japanese authorities should allow any bunch of people who turn up with torches and bag of tools to pile in and start digging in the debris. Heaven help us if he was ever in charge of anything significant.
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It appears to be no-one's 'fault' per se, but a breakdown in commincation - literally in the apparent absence of interpereters for the aid workers.
Re. your thir paragraph AOG - my views on this approach are well known to you, and other regulars, i will abstain from clogging up your thread by posting them again, and possible leading everyone off-track.
Re. your thir paragraph AOG - my views on this approach are well known to you, and other regulars, i will abstain from clogging up your thread by posting them again, and possible leading everyone off-track.
From your own, beloved, Daily Mail....
<<However, faced with new criticism after a series of fiascos over Libya, Foreign Secretary William Hague pinned the blame for the aborted mission on the IRC's own failure to be properly equipped. He said it was 'convenient' for it to blame UK red tape instead.
'The Japanese Embassy advised them that they would have to be self-sufficient and that Japan would not be able to provide logistical support,' he said.
'They arrived there with no transport or logistical or language support in place so I think that gave rise to the difficulty.
'They are a respected organisation and we want them to be able to help in many occasions in the future but I think sometimes it's convenient to blame our embassies for difficulties which have arisen in other ways.' >>>
<<However, faced with new criticism after a series of fiascos over Libya, Foreign Secretary William Hague pinned the blame for the aborted mission on the IRC's own failure to be properly equipped. He said it was 'convenient' for it to blame UK red tape instead.
'The Japanese Embassy advised them that they would have to be self-sufficient and that Japan would not be able to provide logistical support,' he said.
'They arrived there with no transport or logistical or language support in place so I think that gave rise to the difficulty.
'They are a respected organisation and we want them to be able to help in many occasions in the future but I think sometimes it's convenient to blame our embassies for difficulties which have arisen in other ways.' >>>
To answer the old git's question:
<<Wouldn't it make a refreshing change , for the media to state that 'Johnny Foreigner' just does not want our 'proffered help' so s0d them, let them get on with it, and keep our resources for our own peoples? >>
Yes it might make a change.
The only drawback is that it would also be wrong, offensive, stupidly generalised, ill thought out and despicable.
And any decent person with respectable values and beliefs would be appalled by it.
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<<Wouldn't it make a refreshing change , for the media to state that 'Johnny Foreigner' just does not want our 'proffered help' so s0d them, let them get on with it, and keep our resources for our own peoples? >>
Yes it might make a change.
The only drawback is that it would also be wrong, offensive, stupidly generalised, ill thought out and despicable.
And any decent person with respectable values and beliefs would be appalled by it.
.
Is this not yet another example of the DM giving the wrong impression but for some reason they seem to have it in for William Haig.
As I have said before a minister can only act on advice from the people who advise him, its like your heating system needs fixing you don't call a plumber for advice and do something else.
As we are all unaware as to what Haig was told about Libya we will never know how much of the decision was his. I would be suprised if he was a aware of the Japanese situation until it blew up. I am all for accountability but it must be tempered with some common sense.
Also why is it whenever the Brits abroad do something wrong and "johnny foriegner" catches us at it, they are always wrong? Go to Saudi and drink, local law says 2 yrs inside, terrible Saudis horrible etc. Get caught trafficking 2k of Cocaine through Bangcock airport and get 14 years, oh it was someone elses, I was duped oh what a hell hole of a prison mis carriage etc etc.
I don't think "johnny foriegner" is as stupid as the British media would have us believe.
As I have said before a minister can only act on advice from the people who advise him, its like your heating system needs fixing you don't call a plumber for advice and do something else.
As we are all unaware as to what Haig was told about Libya we will never know how much of the decision was his. I would be suprised if he was a aware of the Japanese situation until it blew up. I am all for accountability but it must be tempered with some common sense.
Also why is it whenever the Brits abroad do something wrong and "johnny foriegner" catches us at it, they are always wrong? Go to Saudi and drink, local law says 2 yrs inside, terrible Saudis horrible etc. Get caught trafficking 2k of Cocaine through Bangcock airport and get 14 years, oh it was someone elses, I was duped oh what a hell hole of a prison mis carriage etc etc.
I don't think "johnny foriegner" is as stupid as the British media would have us believe.
jackthehat
Always ready to enter debate with your usual abrasiive comments, have you ever thought of changing your attitude?
At no time did I state the reason for their refusal into Japan, only that they did not have the correct papers, or that they were either an independent body or official, it matters not.
The news report stated,
/// They claimed they were unable to get to work because the British Embassy could not help them secure crucial papers which would have allowed them passage through roadblocks.///
So I still maintain that 'Beggars cannot be choosers' and when faced with such devastation, and with lives waiting to be saved, Japan should not be insisting that all the 'Ts are crossed and dotted' before allowing valuable help into their country.
Always ready to enter debate with your usual abrasiive comments, have you ever thought of changing your attitude?
At no time did I state the reason for their refusal into Japan, only that they did not have the correct papers, or that they were either an independent body or official, it matters not.
The news report stated,
/// They claimed they were unable to get to work because the British Embassy could not help them secure crucial papers which would have allowed them passage through roadblocks.///
So I still maintain that 'Beggars cannot be choosers' and when faced with such devastation, and with lives waiting to be saved, Japan should not be insisting that all the 'Ts are crossed and dotted' before allowing valuable help into their country.
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