HS2 Hits The Buffers.....

[mushroom25]

http://www.spectator....2-the-rail-to-nowhere

essentially, HS2 is not currently required, since almost the same level of capacity improvement can be achieved with almost nil infrastructure expenditure (by lengthening the pendolinos, and allowing the slower trains to run at 110mph rather than 100 - both of which are in progress).

the only reason for persisting with HS2 now would be to build in the capacity improvement that will be necessary in 20-30 year's time, when fossil fuels become too expensive for internal flights.

so, should this still be progressed now, or left until 10-20 years hence, when the cost will have spiralled?

[jno]

heaven forbid that the British should indulge in long-term planning. Getting through the next election should be the main concern at all times.

[sunny-dave]

Bin the thing entirely - a vanity project addressing almost no real issues and costing a king's ransom.

[Mosaic]

I'm really very serious about this: why isn't anyone looking at dirigibles as a viable future option? No tracks, minimal fuel.

[jake-the-peg]

Dirigibles?

Seriously?

How long would it take to get to say Scotland? a week?

[VHG]

But HS2 is not for NOW.

Phase 1 between London and Birmingham is not due to open till 2026 (probably later with the way these things work).

Remember they had the same complaints when they tried to build the canals in the 1700s, or the motorways in the 1960s and beyond.

And all these people who live in the country and moan about HS2, I bet they use the M40, or M6, or M5, and all of them went through green belt land.

[Davethedog]

I agree JNO but then again I take it the money is looking after european bankers now.

[jake-the-peg]

Well I live quite close to the route but I'm not directly affected

I have a few problems with it

1/ the environmental case is a joke - it relys on the assumption that it will free up slots at Heathrow which will not then be filled

2/ The economic case is very dubious - right now it will cost £32 Billion - that's over £500 for every man woman and child in the country call it £1,000 for every taxpayer regardless of where they live!

They estimate up to £46 billion of benefits

But operating costs have ben omitted bringing up the cost to £44 Billion

And it assumes 27% inflation in fares.

We also know that costs on projects like this typically overrun wildly


Let me ask a question

Would you invest your own money in HS2?

I wouldn't

[VHG]

Thameslnk runing North South across London cost about 6 billion.

CrossRail running West East across London is going to cost about 16 billion.

You dont hear the same complaints about those projects.

[sunny-dave]

... because they just might deliver some concrete benefits to the general travelling public.

[jake-the-peg]

//CrossRail running West East across London is going to cost about 16 billion//

So in the context of that who thinks HS2 is goingto come in at £32 billion?

Would anbody invest their personal money this?

No?

So why should we invest taxpayers'?

[pdq1]

You'll probably need to take out a second mortgage to buy an annual season ticket. So only the rich and those that get free season tickets like MPs will use it.
They would be better investing in projects like the Severn Barrier that can benefit us all.

[Nibble]

High Speed trains have made a huge difference to us in this corner of Kent - we can now get into London in an hour, instead of two. However - a normal annual season ticket is £4300, a HS1 ticket is £5600.

[EvianBaby]

VHG, you are right. I live in one of the affected areas and I do use the M40. In order to use HS2 I'd have to learn to run very quickly and do a lot of work on my vaulting skills.

Agree with Dave in that it's a vanity project. Just to say 'oh, look what we did'.

[emmie]

It would have a massive impact on euston, where houses, homes, businesses would have to be demolished, and the residents rehoused elsewhere. The information i last had a look at, was that an old hospital near them would be pulled down, and new homes and business premises built. Not sure of total cost but it would be millions. The residents and business people in that area have been petitioning for ages to get it stopped as the cost to them, and the loss of their businesses would be huge.