Why Is The Bible Good News . Update.

[modeller]

You will remember last week I was going to the above talk. I went there and pointed out the only good news was to tyrants who wanted to copy Gods violence . I then produced a poem I had written to demonstrate how badly the bible treated women .
My contribution was received in deathly silence. The speaker tried to wriggle around it and suggested it might be a good subject in the future.
For what its worth here it is : It needs to be read aloud.

Women’s Rights according to the Bible:
....................................................
Women listen , this what you must do .
Obey your husbands , it’s God’s word so it must be true.

It’s there in Genesis three
Desire your husband and he shall rule over thee.
........................................................................
And if we look at Corinthians 11 and 14’
A women’s role there can be clearly seen ..

Keep silent and by your husband be led .
As the law saith in everything he is the head.
.........................................................................
And as is stated in Ephesian fives
The message is clear to all the wives.

For the husband is head of the wife
To him must she dedicate her whole life.
........................................................................

I n Collosian three –eighteen
The message repeats itself again and again.

Wives of this you must admit
Unto you husbands you must submit.
.........................................................................

Peter, Titus and Timothy have no time for women’s chatter.
These are the things that really matter.

Do not usurp the man’s authority
Be obedient and subjective to his superiority.

[douglas9401]

Titus seems to have been aptly named.

Begone o repeater of drivel.

[douglas9401]

whoops......could have been your parting shot.

[chrisgel]

I like it modeller - A point well made. But in my experience, no matter how the point is made, they never listen.

[jomifl]

Chris has it about right, I think poetry stands as much chance as reason, which is wierd. I think ridicule has most chance of success as it undermines their self belief as well as any others.

[modeller]

Can you imagine it 30 people sitting in complete silence, I had obviously stunned them. The speaker said it was a great poem but it would need further consideration.
Half the people there were women but also never said a word.

[naomi24]

Will the speaker let you know when he arranges that future meeting?

[modeller]

Naomi Yes , it's an open meeting advertised by the community centre and the organiser says he needs the voice of dissent. Whether he will be so keen after this episode is another matter. Normally the themes are more of a moral nature from a Christian point of view but this time it was directly bible based and I was able to use the bible against the bible.

[idiosyncrasy]

What a load of rubbish! I have read the Bible and I don't interpret it this way. True, it says that the man is head of the household, it also says that he is responsible for providing for his family.

It also states that he must love his wife as his own body, thereby not doing anything to her that he would not have done to himself.

He also has to show her love & respect and conduct himself in a manner in which to earn her respect.

It also says that a man should have only one wife, and not to commit adultery, fornication etc. And that the only dissolution of a marriage is death.

Amazing isn't it, how things can be distorted!

Also, if you fully understand the Bible's message, you cannot use the Bible against itself. It has been tried many, many times over the centuries, and
failed.

[goodlife]

Very Good,Mod, Yes, as a man of worldly learning can be granted, this truth, what about the importance of love to human well-being is not something new. It may only now have come to be appreciated by learned men of the world, but it appeared in God’s Word over 19 centuries ago. That is why the apostle Paul could write: “Now, however, there remain faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.” (1 Corinthians 13:13) Do you know why love is greater than faith and hope? Why may it be said that love is the greatest of God’s attributes and of the fruits of his spirit.
But do know why did Paul say that this kind of love was greater than faith? He wrote at 1 Corinthians 13:2: “If I have the gift of prophesying and am acquainted with all the sacred secrets and all knowledge, and if I have all the faith so as to transplant mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing.” (Compare Matthew 17:20.) Yes, if your efforts to acquire knowledge and grow in faith were to be undertaken for a selfish purpose, this would bring us no benefit from God. Similarly, Jesus showed that some would ‘prophesy in his name, expel demons in his name, and perform many powerful works in his name’ but would not have his approval.—Matthew 7:22, 23.

[modeller]

//idiosyncrasy What a load of rubbish! I have read the Bible and I don't interpret it this way. //
You don't need to interpret it they are the 'actual' words of the bible.
You may not like them and chose other passages in mitigation but that doesn't change those actual words.

[chrisgel]

Idiosyncracy - //Amazing isn't it, how things can be distorted!//
Yes it is isn't it. If you took 10 Christians and questioned them about the Bible you would find 10 different "portable" bibles. Each one different to the next.
The bible is like a recipe book for christians where they can pick and choose the bits that most suit them and ignore the rest.
This is why you get some who couldn't care less about "gay marriage" and some who are dead against it. Yet the all use the same Bible.
Those of us who don't believe have no problem with "interpreting" the bible because we take the words at face value and are able to see what a vile piece of work it really is. Murder, rape, sacrifice and slavery. It's all there and doesn't need interpreting,

[modeller]

Idiosyncracy -//What a load of rubbish!//

Here is what you call rubbish : Your bible's actual words.

Genesis 3:16 ...........to thy husband , and he shall rule over thee.
1 Corinthians 11:3 ....and the head of the woman is the man..
1 Corinthians 14:34-36 Let your women keep silent in the churches, for it is not permitted unto them to speak,but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn anything, let them ask their husbands at home, for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.
Ephesians 5:22-24 Wives submit yourselves unto your husbands, as unto the Lord . For the husband is the head of the wife .............Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ , let the the wives be to their husbands in everything.
Colossians 3:18 Wives submit yourselves unto your husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.
1Timothy 2:11:15 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.
But I suffer not a woman to teach,nor to usurp authority over the man, but be in silence.
Titus 2:4-5 Teach the young woman to be.....obedient to their own husbands,......
1Peter 3:1 Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your husbands.

You can wriggle as much as you like and quote passages in mitigation but nothing alters the actual words and commands as written.

[chrisgel]

//1 Corinthians 14:34-36 Let your women keep silent in the churches, for it is not permitted unto them to speak//

Has nobody told this lot?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23222061

[modeller]

chrysgel
As idiosyncrasy says //What a load of rubbish! I have read the Bible and I don't interpret it this way. //

[chrisgel]

See, there's your problem modeller. You're taking the bible literally and you're not supposed to. Except when you are supposed to.
I hope this makes things clearer for you. ;o)

[Octavius]

"Half the people there were women but also never said a word."

Maybe they were observing 1 Timothy 2, 11:15.

[goodlife]

No,In regard to the expression “full submission” at 1 Timothy 2:11 (New International Version), Bible scholar W. E. Vine states: “The injunction is not directed towards a surrender of mind and conscience, or the abandonment of duty of private judgment; the phrase ‘with all subjection’ is a warning against the usurpation of authority, as, e.g., in the next verse

[modeller]

chrisgel //See, there's your problem modeller. You're taking the bible literally and you're not supposed to. Except when you are supposed to.
I hope this makes things clearer for you. ;o) //

Yes I now get it, it's in Revelation 22:13
" I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End." It is the literal truth and its not the literal truth at the same time.

[chrisgel]

Apologetics again Goodlife. Do you know W. E. Vine personally? Why would you need to have someone "interpret" your bible for you?
Could it be that, as with most devout christians, you are happy to let others do your thinking for you? There's not much point in reading the bible then is there?
Why not just let someone who you've never met do all your thinking for you?
Saves on headache tablets as well doesn't it?

[jim360]

"You're taking the bible literally and you're not supposed to. Except when you are supposed to. I hope this makes things clearer for you."

That's probably the best summary of how this works that I've seen.