Body & Soul10 mins ago
Barack Obama
Letter in The times yesterday was querying why he refers to himself as black when his mother is white. Same with Halle Berry - she has a white mother yet refers to herself as black.
It got me wondering. What is the correct term nowadays? Coloured is out as is half-caste (quite rightly in my opinion- horrible expressions).
Afro-European was suggested.
Whatever they are, Barack Obama and Halle Berry are not black.
It got me wondering. What is the correct term nowadays? Coloured is out as is half-caste (quite rightly in my opinion- horrible expressions).
Afro-European was suggested.
Whatever they are, Barack Obama and Halle Berry are not black.
Answers
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During her 2002 Oscar acceptance speech Halle Berry used the phrase "woman of colo(u)r".
Further insight to Halle's bi-racial identification...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halle_Berry#Racia l_self-identification
Further insight to Halle's bi-racial identification...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halle_Berry#Racia l_self-identification
They're bi-racial.
This is a term that I first heard a few years back, and I think it sounds preferable to 'mixed race' which is a term that I used at school.
The actual answer is that 'black' covers an wide spread of racial backgrounds...you can be very light skinned black from say St Kitts, or very dark skinned black from Malawi.
Many people from the 'smaller' West Indian islands consider themselves black, even if they have even the smallest amount of European blood in them.
This is a term that I first heard a few years back, and I think it sounds preferable to 'mixed race' which is a term that I used at school.
The actual answer is that 'black' covers an wide spread of racial backgrounds...you can be very light skinned black from say St Kitts, or very dark skinned black from Malawi.
Many people from the 'smaller' West Indian islands consider themselves black, even if they have even the smallest amount of European blood in them.
Bi-racial? Really..? Surely that causes problems though?
If you get a bi-racial person and a person of a third race having a child, the child is surely tri-racial? Two bi-racial people could produce a quadracial child. The fractions surely get difficult after a while! :-)
I would have thought having one term for people of more than one race was sufficient.
If you get a bi-racial person and a person of a third race having a child, the child is surely tri-racial? Two bi-racial people could produce a quadracial child. The fractions surely get difficult after a while! :-)
I would have thought having one term for people of more than one race was sufficient.
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brionon - becuase they would get more grief from their coloured friends/family etc asking them why are they denying their colour/race etc. Being white is definitely not in vogue.
But does it really matter what colour we are? There is good and bad in each and every race. We should just take people at face value and not generalise by race, colour or culture..
But does it really matter what colour we are? There is good and bad in each and every race. We should just take people at face value and not generalise by race, colour or culture..
Apparently, the black Americans are not too keen on him
If during the campaign , he still is not getting their support , it will be interesting to see if he decides to change tactics and start to put emphasis his white side
chitchat - regarding the second paragraph of your post - I totally agree - unfortunately ( despite the efforts of people like Martin Luther King - and others ) there remains , sadly , a lot of prejudice in this world of our's
If during the campaign , he still is not getting their support , it will be interesting to see if he decides to change tactics and start to put emphasis his white side
chitchat - regarding the second paragraph of your post - I totally agree - unfortunately ( despite the efforts of people like Martin Luther King - and others ) there remains , sadly , a lot of prejudice in this world of our's
Further to sp1814's post:
Some people take a very wide view of the definition of 'black'. Back in the 1980s, all of the staff, from the school which I taught at, attended an in-service training day. (Our school had very few pupils who were 'non-white' and we had requested this day to seek ways to promote racial understanding among our pupils).
The course was run by two gentlemen, of Afro-Caribbean origin, who seemed determined to spend the time lecturing our all-white staff on the evils of racism (which was 'preaching to the converted' anyway), rather than helping us to find ways to promote multi-culturalism.
At one point, I struggled to find a word which collectively referred to all people who were 'non-white'. The course leaders had no difficulty in offering a collective term. They insisted that the word I should use was 'black'. When I pointed out that I doubted that this would be a term with which, for example, children from some Asian countries would be happy with, I was met with an extremely aggressive response. I was told, extremely forcefully, that I must always refer to people from India, China and Japan as 'black'.
The following day, I asked one of my pupils what she thought about this. (Her family ran the local Chinese take-away). I specifically asked if she wanted to be called 'black'. Her response was extremely forthright but I couldn't criticize her for her choice of words because she said exactly what I was thinking!
Chris
Some people take a very wide view of the definition of 'black'. Back in the 1980s, all of the staff, from the school which I taught at, attended an in-service training day. (Our school had very few pupils who were 'non-white' and we had requested this day to seek ways to promote racial understanding among our pupils).
The course was run by two gentlemen, of Afro-Caribbean origin, who seemed determined to spend the time lecturing our all-white staff on the evils of racism (which was 'preaching to the converted' anyway), rather than helping us to find ways to promote multi-culturalism.
At one point, I struggled to find a word which collectively referred to all people who were 'non-white'. The course leaders had no difficulty in offering a collective term. They insisted that the word I should use was 'black'. When I pointed out that I doubted that this would be a term with which, for example, children from some Asian countries would be happy with, I was met with an extremely aggressive response. I was told, extremely forcefully, that I must always refer to people from India, China and Japan as 'black'.
The following day, I asked one of my pupils what she thought about this. (Her family ran the local Chinese take-away). I specifically asked if she wanted to be called 'black'. Her response was extremely forthright but I couldn't criticize her for her choice of words because she said exactly what I was thinking!
Chris
In answer to brionon's question, I think people who are a mixture of black and white tend to look more like a black person than a white person, as the dark coloured melanin pigment in their skin is genetically dominant to the pale pigment. I think therefore that the answer lies in your appearance. Looking at Halle Berry, she does look black, although she is a paler colour. Looking however, at the love child of Boris Becker, I would imagine that she would probably call herself 'white' as she doesn't appear to be anything else......or maybe I am totally wrong here!
Perhaps SP1814 can help out here?
Perhaps SP1814 can help out here?
If Halle Berry or Barack Obama referred to themselves as white, I think the bureaucrats who relish categorizing every aspect of our being, would beg to differ.
This is the one area of politics where I find myself in agreement with John Wayne. He had a dislike of hyphenated terminology and thought people should be content to describe themselves as 'Americans'; first, last and foremost.
This is the one area of politics where I find myself in agreement with John Wayne. He had a dislike of hyphenated terminology and thought people should be content to describe themselves as 'Americans'; first, last and foremost.
Le Chat
Weirdly, we were just talking about Halle at work just now (it was a branch off about a conversation about Vin Diesel and Leona - the winner of last year's X Factor).
If you ask me, I think that Halle has 'typically' white features, whereas Leona has 'typically' black features.
...and that's it I suppose - bi-racial celebrities go across the whole range of features and skin tones.
Take Prince for instance - Hispanisc (I believe) mother and black father.
Weirdly, we were just talking about Halle at work just now (it was a branch off about a conversation about Vin Diesel and Leona - the winner of last year's X Factor).
If you ask me, I think that Halle has 'typically' white features, whereas Leona has 'typically' black features.
...and that's it I suppose - bi-racial celebrities go across the whole range of features and skin tones.
Take Prince for instance - Hispanisc (I believe) mother and black father.
....and Vin Diesel is one of the luckiest actors in the world, because white lads can identify with him because he kinda looks white.
Black lads can identify with him because he kinda looks black.
Hispanic lads can identify with him because he looks kinda Hispanic
...oh, and bad actors can identify with him because...well, need I go on?
Black lads can identify with him because he kinda looks black.
Hispanic lads can identify with him because he looks kinda Hispanic
...oh, and bad actors can identify with him because...well, need I go on?
Buenchico
I'm afraid that the two men you refer to who came to your school are from a very common racial sub-grouping.
Their racial group isn't actually 'black'. It's something else...something that rhymes with 'tanker'.
It irritates me up to the eyeballs whenever someone takes it upon themselves to sermonise or think that they're speaking on behalf of a whole group of people.
God, as a black man, I would LOVE to have been there to sort out their ignorance.
But then again...that WAS 20 years ago.
I'm afraid that the two men you refer to who came to your school are from a very common racial sub-grouping.
Their racial group isn't actually 'black'. It's something else...something that rhymes with 'tanker'.
It irritates me up to the eyeballs whenever someone takes it upon themselves to sermonise or think that they're speaking on behalf of a whole group of people.
God, as a black man, I would LOVE to have been there to sort out their ignorance.
But then again...that WAS 20 years ago.
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