Have NOT Of

[acw]

Slightly more of a request than a question, but I am interested in your views.  Please could people learn that:

INCORRECT: "I must of forgotten it"

CORRECT: "I must have forgotten it"

Why do so many people make this mistake?  Do you think they will learn now that I have pointed it out?  Do you think this is down to poor pronunciation like the asked/aksed problem, or do you think schools play a major role as in the grammar/apostrophe thread?

Cheers!

[Quizmonster]

The reason people make the mistake is because of the frequently-used elided form of 'have'...as in "I must've seen him since then" or "She could've been there if she'd wanted, surely!" The point is that these sound virtually identical to "must of" and "could of".

Of course they won't learn now that you've pointed it out. It almost certainly is related to apostrophe misuse. Children should be taught that - in informal writing - "must've" is perfectly acceptable but that "must of" is always manifest nonsense.

[Quizmonster]

This has just reminded me of one of the finest word-creation efforts I ever came across in schoolmastering days. It was: "I was spostive visited my grandmother, but I went to the cinema instead." Brilliant!

[jno]

Dead right, Quizmonster, and a splendid neologism too. The problem, I think, is that nobody reads much these days so they don't get the opportunity to correlate what they hear with words they see in print. Even when they do read, on the internet for instance (and even on Answerbank), it's often written by people who can't spell. Even 'official' writing - in books from well known publishers, for instance, where you could once expect to find correct English - is often full of errors, so people who do read are often reading bad English without knowing it. And yes, regrettably, teachers often spell badly too, even English teachers.

[littleoldme]

acw - this has been a bugbear of mine for a long time now, and I'm not normally prone to pedantry.

Now, if we could just cure another epidemic and get people to realise that "lose", "loser" and "losing" are spelt with ONE 'o' - ONE, dammit - then I'll be happy.
lose = to mislay; to be defeated in a contest
loose = of generous fit; free, possibly having escaped (esp. of an animal)
I mean, it's not that hard, is it? Grrr.

[smorodina]

'Official' company e-mail from our IS department about two weeks age: 'You may of experienced some problems with the internet this morning...' My pet hate - used by the majority of my work colleagues is 'we was, you was'.

[smudge]

acw - I agree! 

Also, people who say "It's yorn"  instead of 'your one'.....etc.

[smudge]

That's yorn instead of That's your one, or that's yours!

Gggrrrr - I'll be off now!

[acw]

Littleoldme - the mistake you described was one of two mistakes in their English that I would not overlook in my "foreign" friends' use of the language during my ERASMUS studies in Hamburg this year.  The second, for the record, was the difference between borrow and lend!

 

I'm happy being pedantic!!  Worrying about the little things allows me to avoid stressing about the big things! Teehee! :-)

[flaming]

Acw is to be congratulated on starting this thread.  What an opportunity for some ABers to have a moan about things which don't matter to others but which grieve all of us each time they are said (and written, as Smorodina testifies).  I have been too cowardly and, if I say it myself,  too kind to point out to friends or family their verbal mistakes, the confusion between 'of' and 'have' being a prime example.   The 'was'  thing continues today as does the misuse of 'those', 'these' and 'them'.  I wince internally when I hear the words 'them ones'.  However, I have been putting up with such verbal mistakes for many years and have to accept  that it  'ain't gonna' change.                                                         

P.S.  I once saw chalked on a blackboard outside a pub. :  'cold larger sold here.....'  .  Amongst all the spelling mistakes which I  see - and cannot help but notice - the memory of that one always makes me smile.

[Peter Pedant]

oh no-one has pointed out the similarity to kind of and sort of. This get tortured into:

I kind of hit him     or

I sudduv hit him, and clearly is related to the admission

I mustuv hit him   or

cudduv hit him.

This has been around for at least fifty years

[THECORBYLOON]

Peter Pedant "This get tortured into" what does that mean?

[bernardo]

Why do so many people make this mistake? 

Because they were not paying attention in English grammar lessons, because they have no sense of logic or construction, because they are evil and stupid.

Do you think they will learn now that I have pointed it out? 

No, because they have always been doing it for decades and they are far too stupid to absorb the truth, no matter how many times they are corrected.

Do you think this is down to poor pronunciation like the asked/aksed problem,

No, because it is a matter of logical grammatical construction rather than pronunciation.  There is no difficulty for us normal pedants in distinguishing between "its" and "it's", or "whose" and "who's", even though they are pronounced identically, because we understand the different meanings.

or do you think schools play a major role as in the grammar/apostrophe thread?

No, it's because pupils don't pay attention to the teachers.

[Grunty]

smudge - 'Yorn' was in common usage  in country districts when I was young.  I have always thought it meant 'yours' as a similar word to 'mine'

[smudge]

Grunty - 'yorn' does mean 'yours' , but I prefer to hear 'yours' - I think it sounds much nicer.

Lots of people I know from Essex still say 'yorn' too!

[brionon]

I wonder if you sometimes hear of when what was said was 've, as in I must've forgotten ?

[brionon]

My pet hates are people not understanding the rule for ''Alternative'' -that is ''Two choices =One alternative''.

And saying 'Refute' when they mean 'Deny'.

[magicdice]

please don't blame it entirely on the schools! i'm seventeen, in full-time education. my academic strengths have always been maths, science and foreign languages, however i manage to use spelling, grammar and punctuation. now, i didn't just pick this up by myself - i was taught how to use the english language, and so while it may have been good 'back in your day', it's just as good today. feel free to blame it on the fashion of using txt spk in emails, on msn messenger, in notes to friends in classes... children ARE taught to use good english, but evidently choose not to do so.

PS: i am aware that i don't capitalise proper nouns and at the start of sentences, this is due to aesthetics as well as laziness, and the fact that i don't think using the wrong case impedes comprehension of what i'm saying. for the record, i do capitalise when i write, and when i type things that aren't intended solely for the internet.

[marianne joy]

And yours and you're people don't seem to know the difference. I get so annoyed