Listener 4305: Not A Blocked Grid By Lavatch

[AHearer]

Another excellent construction. The top right corner held me up for a while, but once the penny dropped I could sit back and admire Lavatch's skill -- many thanks.

[contendo]

Thanks, Dolphy. That has at least settled doubts over one of the letters. Funny definition though. I don't know how Lavatch got away with it.

[sunny-dave]

Very enjoyable - and for some reason I didn't find it as tricky as some people have - perhaps the double espresso fired up a few extra neurons this morning.

Thanks Lavatch.

[scooterbug]

Isn't one of the final entries actually two words? Should that have been noted in the preamble?

[scooterbug]

Answering my own question, I guess, but is the idea that the two-word entry "consists" of real words, even though it is not itself a real word? Still think it might (should) have been mentioned.

[EAChaplin]

I see your point scooterbug but think 'consists of real words' just about gets away with it. Maybe the editors didn't want to give the hint. Talking of which how nice to see that a solver can ask for clarification of a clue here, and receive a hint which gives nothing away to those still solving.

[Ruthrobin]

Though, EAChaplin, we tread a dangerous line and, over the years, have struggled to keep this site free from such hints. Some of us willingly help newcomers and struggling solvers off-line (with the logic, I believe, that such solvers are not the ones competing for the 'all correct status' and that we all hope more people will be encouraged to keep attempting the Listener) but there has been a furious reaction from purists when hints have appeared here - even ones that don't affect people still solving. Sorry if I sound like a lecturing school marm - comments like this one of mine always stir up responses!

[Whenland]

Finally completed this one this afternoon. As others have said, clues very hard but well worth the effort of soldiering on. Thanks Lavatch.

[olichant]

For what (little) it's worth, I agree with Ruthrobin - I think these threads tend to strike a really nice balance.

I'm sure many of us will have seen the threads on another crossword site which tend to be much more explicit, and I'm not really sure how I feel about them. On the one hand, I'd rather that as many people as possible were enjoying the Listener and encouraging each other to get as much as possible out of it. On the other, it is always really galling when someone just gives away the theme - it really does spoil it for people who haven't finished yet, and sort of misses the point of the fun that results when pennies start to drop.

I suspect some people feel far more strongly about it than I do, though!

[djawhufc]

Hi Olichant/RuthRobin

Speaking as someone who has been attempting The Listener for about a year I think that this forum is just about right. It is clear that people don't want the answers as uch but rather enjoy the discussion of the solving process itself.

However, when one starts The Listener it can be mystifying. I have been helped 'offline' by Don and his patience particularly in the early days in helping a fledgling solver was appreciated.

I answer queries on the other crossword site as do a few others. I take the approach that it is a seperate forum and if people need some encouragement, particularly when they are starting out, I feel that is ok.

I don't look there before I have completed it as I agree it would spoil my fun. But surely the answer is for those who want to do battle with the crossword and finish it on their own just to ignore the thread on the other site?

[Whenland]

I like this site because, as we are relative beginners, we know we won't finish all Listeners but find that remarks such as "well worth the effort" or "there is no mistake in 21 ac" encourage us to persevere. So we do look on this site, often well before finishing, to find out what we're up against and don't regard that as cheating.