Listener No. 4405: Revision By Tangram

[AHearer]

Nice and straightforward. I felt we could have been left to work out for ourselves which entry was reversed, and I wasn't too keen on the cryptic clues to the second line, but it's always good to be introduced to a poem one hadn't met before. Many thanks, Tangram.

[AHearer]

Sorry, ...third line...

[Ruthrobin]

Yes, maybe that clue number will be different in the printed version tomorrow but this was indeed nice and straightforward. I agree, good to be introduced to a poem and poet one doesn't know and to read about him too.

[olichant]

I agree, too. Some nice relief after a distinctly weird and wonky week. Thanks, Tangram.

The new Schadenfreude in CAM looks interesting for anyone wanting extra entertainment over the weekend.

[starwalker]

Sorry, but I'm in the Z-cup camp on this one. I think that the reversed / jumbled entry should have been left to the solver to identify and resolve and the two missing words being used in the clues was but a token. Thanks Tangram, but not for me.

[Flocker14]

Was helped by an immediate hit on Google at an early stage ; the extra letters made it easier to access some of the trickier clues. The preamble was a tad generous perhaps - but I enjoyed it anyway. Thanks Tangram.
The Cam is interesting - the final step still eludes me and there the preamble doesn't give anything away

[Hagen]

Agreed, the preamble gave rather more information up front than is usual, which meant a nice quick solve. I never complain when a puzzle's easy! I enjoyed discovering the thematic material, which was new to me. Thanks Tangram.

BTW what exactly is a Z Cup? It's obviously a thumbs-down but where does it come from? Big boob, perhaps?

[Scorpius]

A comfortable and enjoyable solve, though one or two clues had me scratching my head before fully working out the wordplay.
I agree that the preamble might have been less specific, and I feel that some nice thematic opportunities offered by the poem have been missed.

[pushmi-pullyu]

Almost there, having wasted a lot of time completely taken in by the red herring.

[pushmi-pullyu]

And now I am there.

[icynorth]

I struggled last week, so it was a relief to have an easier puzzle with a fine theme. Thanks, Tangram.

[aldanna]

No criticisms from me. I enjoyed this puzzle.

[s_pugh]

At first I was inclined to agree with starwalker but the more I looked at it the more I admired the cleverness of the construction. A good mix of tricky and not so tricky clues too, and an introduction to a poet and work I hadn't come across before. Thanks Tangram.

[Ruthrobin]

Hagen, I believe the Z cup was originally Alekhine's creation - awarded on the AB to the most feeble, disastrous or appalling Listener crossword - as a sort of counter to the Ascot Gold Cup that is awarded by a vote of all the solvers who get 100% of their submitted solutions correct for the year. Last year, that went, with a considerable margin, to Shackleton for his one about the animals going into the ark (Shackleton who did the brilliant '6 Across' this year).

[petefoxes]

Agree with most comments - nice construction and clues, thematic opportunities underused, generous preamble. I was irritated slightly by 28d.

[UglyUncle]

Yes, it's pleasant to have a straightforward solve now and again, and I'm not really complaining (honest), BUT this was a Listener puzzle, and I think it must be stated quite emphatically that the editors should have counselled Tangram against giving the game away so completely about the treated line. One didn't actually have to locate and read the poem in order to complete the grid. Where was the PDM?

[Philoctetes]

I agree with Ugly - it's good, but it's not quite Listener. No real connection between theme and puzzle. The background theme deserved more.
Far be it from me to dispute with RuthRobin, but I thought the Z-cup was initiated by someone whose name began Z (Zabadak? Zebedee?) to be awarded to the grumpiest contribution of the week. Perhaps I am wrong, perhaps it evolved further.

[Hagen]

Thanks, Ruthrobin, for the clarification.

The AB comments for Shackleton's Mixed Doubles are mostly complimentary though! I remember taking one look at it, realising it was way beyond me, and running off to the pub.

[starwalker]

I believe that it was Zabadak's creation.

[Ruthrobin]

Yes, indeed, it was Zabadak wasn't it and it was, indeed, for the person making the grumpiest comments about a puzzle.

[Hagen]

That makes more sense in the light of the comments on the Shackleton puzzle. Thanks again.

I hope never to be awarded the Z Cup!