hydrogen/water vaper cars

[daleroy]

I asked a question befor but I ment to say. are water vaper cars a myth???

[lord molly]

no. in america, general motors have designes a car that runs on water. you use hidhtl distelled water to fuel your car. the car then superheats the water causing it to vapourist. the vapour is then seperated into hydrogen and oxygen. the cars combustion system then burns two atoms of hydrogen, which bons with the oxyhgen atom, leaving water again. fantistic, but fantasticly expensive, your looking at �10,000,000 or so.

[Space]

can you point a link about that, lord molly? It doesn't make sense to generate hydrogen from water just to burn it back to water again, because generating hydrogen costs at least as much energy than you will get by burning it ...

[jake-the-peg]

Cars running on water are common frauds, fakes and urban ledgends.

They're all over the net like here:
http://www.spiritofmaat.com/archive/watercar/h 20car2.htm

Note the phrase in this one:
The amount of energy in the water molecule is thus vast, and has absolutely nothing to do with the amount of energy it takes to break down that molecule.

The first phrase is true, the second is rubbish.

As Space points out you cant get more energy out by burning than you put in otherwise you just continue doing it in a cycle - presto! perpetual motion.

There are some misconceptions where people talk abuot HHO cars meaning Hydrogen gas being burnt to make water. People easily mistake this for H2O but many more are confidence tricks and nutters in their garages convincing themselves they'll be rich

[daleroy]

I think lord molly is right but they use some kind of hightech membrain made with some sort of hightech electrolite combined whith some sort of hofgtech polymer this could make buying a car out of the price rang of your average person so I was wondering if there was a more cost effective way to do this

[daleroy]

I almost forgot
this is a cool link

http://www.gm.com/company/gmability/adv_tech/4 00_fcv/index.html

[jake-the-peg]

That's a hydrogen fuel cell car it uses hydrogen to make water.

Membrane technology is used to split hydrogen and oxygen at temperatures between 500 and 900 degrees.

You can then use the hydrogen to run a car.

You can't generate the heat from burning the hydrogen because you need more energy to do the split than you get from burning the hydrogen.

Still if you're convinced you could buy shares in my new "water engine company" ;c)

[Zevon]

You can generate the power by burning hydrogen, so what that you get less out than you put in. If you let that arguement stop you, you wouldn't do anything. Using your computer requires electricity, that requires a power plant, whatever energy source that uses it will be rather inefficient and will lose enrgy, it has to. But the energy gained is in a more useful form and the energy used is useless in its form unless it is used so you may as well use it.
Burning coal loses energy that isn't heat and isn't useful but the stuff that is usefully gained is a damn sight better than just a lump of coal.
A water powered car is no more inefficient thyan a hydroigen powered car, but instead of gaining hydrogen on a grand scale and then putting that in cars, each car is splitting its own hydrogen, the difference is really that oif a supermarket baking bread for everyone, or everyone buying bread makers and making their own.. Anyway electrolysis isn't that expensive and is rather compact, the problems are explosive hydrogen and just getting the car started, once going it can use some energy to help proliferate the mechanism.
But the main benefit is that the wasted energy and the byproducts are not polluting