Bishops

[helen roche]

What do we call a group of bishops?

[sddsddean]

Is it a conclave, or is that just the meeting to elect the Pope?

[roomby]

how about a bash of bishops?

[Quizmonster]

Bishops, collectively, are known as the 'episcopacy'. Since many of them are fond of a tipple themselves and frequently dish out communion-wine to others, why not "a p***-up of episcopals"?

[archhippy]

i think its sinod my dad uses it to talk about the church (hes a vicar) its where they the bishops get together to discuss ideas and comon problems they have had over the year.I hope that helps.

[answerbok]

funny how the word for a group of drinkers chatting, is a symposium - very grand. :-) my vote for roomby's suggestion

[Gillesal]

I don't think there is a collective noun for bishops. When they sit together then within the episcopal (anglican) church they would sit in the House of Bishops which is one of the three houses of Synod. Within the Roman Catholic Church I believe, like Cardinals, they constitute a college. Sddsdean above mentions a conclave but that is the meeting of Cardinals (not bishops) that elect the Pope.

[Cetti]

In my little ' Fact File' book, it agrees with Einstein - a bench.

[Janetex]

My trusty (and not so trusty) list tells me that it's a sea of bishops and a radiance of cardinals. It also includes a prey of nuns, a whored of prostitues. a sulk of teenagers and a quarrel of lawyers........

[Quizmonster]

The Bishops' Bench/Episcopal Bench refers only to the actual bench - ie long wooden seat - in the House of Lords where the Lords Spiritual sit. Of all the meanings of the word 'bench' offered in The Oxford English Dictionary - the 'bible' in such matters - none suggests it is a collective name for bishops, I'm afraid.

[Cetti]

Aha, QM - Handbags at dawn, methinks!!

Just found an incredibly ancient dictionary which goes on for ever describing 'bench' but it does say Bench of Bishops: The Episcopate collectively. What do you think?

[Quizmonster]

As if I would fight with you, Cetti! Would you mind telling me which dictionary you're referring to? Age alone - as I have discovered personally! - does not automatically qualify one for being treated with respect as an authority.

The OED, as you no doubt know, is extremely detailed and scholarly in its handling of the etymology and historical development of English words and phrases. As I said, though, it makes no reference to a "bench of bishops" other than to the one I already mentioned in the House of Lords. Does your dictionary offer a date or a source - eg historical document/novel-title/whatever - as to when and where the phrase supposedly originated?

My problem is, you see, that the OED is regarded by language-experts as the greatest work of language-erudition in history. When it fails to support a claim, I generally do, too. Cheers

[Cetti]

I know, you're too much of a gentleman to fight ;-)

It's an incredibly archaic book called 'The New Elizabethan Reference Dictionary'. It's one of those 1950's volumes that includes legal terms, characters and names from literature etc. but what it doesn't provide is the sort of source, or proof of origin that you require. Never mind - I found this on the first page, absolutely nothing to do with benches or bishops, just thought you might like it.

Words are the dress of thoughts, which should no more be presented in rags, tatters, and dirt, than your person should. Earl of Chesterfield.

[Quizmonster]

Cetti, I just did a search on your dictionary and it was published by Newnes, I see. Next time I'm near Ottakar's, I'm going to go in and ask if it's still available, as it sounds interesting. Certainly I'd never heard of it before. I love the Earl of Chesterfield's quote...perhaps it should be emblazoned as a sort of motto at the head of Answerbank's home page.

Einstein, I'm certainly happy to go with your idea of 'bench' as an 'unofficial' collective noun for bishops.

[Janetex]

My understanding has always been that it is a "bench" of bishops, except in the episcopal church, where a group of bishops is an "episcopate".

[Quizmonster]

The problem is, Janet, that 'episcopate/episcopacy' refer to all the bishops in a given church/religion...ie they are invariably referred to as 'the episcopate'. I'm pretty sure that is not at all what the questioner was asking about. I imagine she wanted something along the lines of a flock of sheep, a coven of witches, a murder of crows etc. You cannot say - in reference to a dozen or so bishops, for example - 'an episcopate of bishops'. It simply isn't a collective noun in that sense and - as Einstein says - there does not really seem to be any word that can be considered an 'official' such collective noun for bishops at all.

[FredPuli]

The new edition of the 'Shorter Oxford ' gives this definition of 'bench' '4. A seat where a number of people sit side by side in some official capacity especially one occupied by a group in the British Parliament. b. the people collectively who occupy such a seat; their status or dignity. To illustrate definition 4 this quote is given first: W Shenstone ' A little bench of heedless bishops. And there a chancellor in embryo' . Now there seems no good reason not to use 'bench' as a collective noun for bishops, quite regardless of whether they happen to be in Parliament or elsewhere and whether or not there is a real, physical, bench involved. This appears to be the meaning in (b) of 4 above. When we speak of 'the judicial bench', 'a bench of judges', 'the High Court bench' or 'the bench' we do not mean that they are sitting together or that they ever do, or that they even use a bench .Why then can we not have 'the episcopal bench' or 'the (or 'a' ) bench of bishops' ? It seems correct and supported by logic and some authority.(Bishop is also mulled , spiced wine; I wonder why ?)

[Quizmonster]

The Shenstone quote offered above by Fred..."a little bench of heedless bishops"...was a reference to an actual bench in an 18th century schoolroom, which is what Shenstone was describing. In other words, these were schoolboys who just might one day become bishops and not actual bishops; their schoolbench might one day be replaced by the Episcopal Bench in the House of Lords as their sitting-place.

As I've already said, I'm perfectly happy for people to refer to a bench of bishops...I'd just like them to be aware that this is a language-structure based on little more than the alliterative 'b'.

I'm sure Fred isn't really saying that - at a coronation, royal wedding or whatever, where several bishops might be involved in the ritual - the next day's newspaper might say: "...a bench of bishops participated in the ceremony". In other words, it is simply not a collective term in the way being asked for here!