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Is It Wrong To Use The Bible As A Standard To Measure What Is Right And Wrong?
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Because a proverb says A bad person will not go unpunished. (Prov. 11:21)
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No,Genuine love for God is not just an abstract quality.
It moves a person to act in another’s interest. The apostle Paul listed many ways that this love can be shown. You look just to mention just a few: Love is long-suffering and kind, Love is not jealous, it does not brag, does not get puffed up, does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked.” (1 Corinthians 13:4, 5)
so displaying this love is an attempt to imitate our heavenly Father. Jesus said: These two commands [loving God and neighbor] sum up the whole of the Law and the Prophets.” (Matthew 22:40,
In other words, if we show this love, we will not steal from our neighbor, or murder, or commit adultery with his wife.
The apostle John agreed, saying: This is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments.—1 John 5:3.
But no you like the world like it is bad.
It moves a person to act in another’s interest. The apostle Paul listed many ways that this love can be shown. You look just to mention just a few: Love is long-suffering and kind, Love is not jealous, it does not brag, does not get puffed up, does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked.” (1 Corinthians 13:4, 5)
so displaying this love is an attempt to imitate our heavenly Father. Jesus said: These two commands [loving God and neighbor] sum up the whole of the Law and the Prophets.” (Matthew 22:40,
In other words, if we show this love, we will not steal from our neighbor, or murder, or commit adultery with his wife.
The apostle John agreed, saying: This is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments.—1 John 5:3.
But no you like the world like it is bad.
@goodlife. The usual qualfication. Now there is a type of love called godly love. Unyet all of those that you claim Paul mentioned seem essentially to be either altruistic or humanitarian love. Nothing to do with love of god specifically.
And your own bible contradicts this, in a way - and not for the first time. Your god is a jealous god, as evidenced by the first of the 10 commandments - how then can this be reconciled by your assertion that gods love in not jealous? And what is bragging, if not building elaborate cathedrals and churches "for the greater glory of god"?
Once again, you fail to make your case, goodlife. And you recognise your own failure with the ridiculous assertion at the end of your comment, which can be paraphrased as " If you do not believe like I believe, then you must be bad". Thats the authentic voice of the bigot, that is...
And your own bible contradicts this, in a way - and not for the first time. Your god is a jealous god, as evidenced by the first of the 10 commandments - how then can this be reconciled by your assertion that gods love in not jealous? And what is bragging, if not building elaborate cathedrals and churches "for the greater glory of god"?
Once again, you fail to make your case, goodlife. And you recognise your own failure with the ridiculous assertion at the end of your comment, which can be paraphrased as " If you do not believe like I believe, then you must be bad". Thats the authentic voice of the bigot, that is...
Yahweh on religious tolerance (Deuteronomy 13:12-18)
12 If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities, which the Lord thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying,
13 Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known;
14 Then shalt thou enquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought among you;
15 Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword.
16 And thou shalt gather all the spoil of it into the midst of the street thereof, and shalt burn with fire the city, and all the spoil thereof every whit, for the Lord thy God: and it shall be an heap for ever; it shall not be built again.
17 And there shall cleave nought of the cursed thing to thine hand: that the Lord may turn from the fierceness of his anger, and shew thee mercy, and have compassion upon thee, and multiply thee, as he hath sworn unto thy fathers;
18 When thou shalt hearken to the voice of the Lord thy God, to keep all his commandments which I command thee this day, to do that which is right in the eyes of the Lord thy God.
12 If thou shalt hear say in one of thy cities, which the Lord thy God hath given thee to dwell there, saying,
13 Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known;
14 Then shalt thou enquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought among you;
15 Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword.
16 And thou shalt gather all the spoil of it into the midst of the street thereof, and shalt burn with fire the city, and all the spoil thereof every whit, for the Lord thy God: and it shall be an heap for ever; it shall not be built again.
17 And there shall cleave nought of the cursed thing to thine hand: that the Lord may turn from the fierceness of his anger, and shew thee mercy, and have compassion upon thee, and multiply thee, as he hath sworn unto thy fathers;
18 When thou shalt hearken to the voice of the Lord thy God, to keep all his commandments which I command thee this day, to do that which is right in the eyes of the Lord thy God.
Simply by asking the question that way, beginning 'Is it wrong...' you are admitting that there is a greater value system than the Bible that can judge whether using the Bible as a standard is a good thing or not.
Which of course is true, but I'm surprised you can see this! Hopefully you can now understand that we really don't need the Bible anyway if we are capable of judging it's worth.
Which of course is true, but I'm surprised you can see this! Hopefully you can now understand that we really don't need the Bible anyway if we are capable of judging it's worth.
Kromovaracun-when a stupid one utters foolishness from start to finish, often arguing from a wrong premise and winding up with false conclusions.
Solomon describes this as follows: The start of the words of his mouth is foolishness, and the end afterward of his mouth is calamitous madness. And the foolish one speaks many words. Man does not know what will come to be; and that which will come to be after him, who can tell him. (Eccl. 10:13, 14) The fool thinks that he can do this.
I'm sorry, goodlife, but the Yahweh of the bible simply cannot conceivably be described as 'loving'. He wantonly slaughters his own people for the most flippant of reasons. Remember when some guy touches the Ark of the Covenant in Samuel? And Yahweh responds by killing thousands of people for miles around?
Or when the Israelites ask him for meat, in Numbers? and he gives them poisonous meat that kills thousands just for complaining? What about when he buries Korah and his family alive for criticising Moses?
If you believe I am foolish or mistaken, then you should show me why I am wrong.
Or when the Israelites ask him for meat, in Numbers? and he gives them poisonous meat that kills thousands just for complaining? What about when he buries Korah and his family alive for criticising Moses?
If you believe I am foolish or mistaken, then you should show me why I am wrong.
//Is It Wrong To Use The Bible As A Standard To Measure What Is Right And Wrong?//
Not necessarily. The graphic descriptions of God’s psychopathic, spiteful, nature, provides us with an excellent example of how NOT to treat our fellow man.
//a proverb says A bad person will not go unpunished. (Prov. 11:21) //
In that case, God's doomed!
Not necessarily. The graphic descriptions of God’s psychopathic, spiteful, nature, provides us with an excellent example of how NOT to treat our fellow man.
//a proverb says A bad person will not go unpunished. (Prov. 11:21) //
In that case, God's doomed!
Kromovaracun-Look at it this way, if you warn your child not to touch the hot flame because he will get burned – what is the consequence if he ignores the warning?
It is the same with Jehovah. He gives a warning that failure to do (or not do) something brings punishment in one way or another therefore it is necessary for him to fulfil that punishment, otherwise he could be classed a liar!
It is the same with Jehovah. He gives a warning that failure to do (or not do) something brings punishment in one way or another therefore it is necessary for him to fulfil that punishment, otherwise he could be classed a liar!
@goodlife More nonsense. Does someone somewhere actually think these are good, well reasoned, compelling arguments?
"Kromovaracun-Look at it this way, if you warn your child not to touch the hot flame because he will get burned – what is the consequence if he ignores the warning?
The consequences are that the child gets burnt, to what extent we do not know. And the child is likely to learn by experience - often a far more powerful teaching aid :)
It is the same with Jehovah. He gives a warning that failure to do (or not do) something brings punishment in one way or another therefore it is necessary for him to fulfil that punishment, otherwise he could be classed a liar!"
Heaven forfend that he might be a liar! In order to avoid that ignominy he smites and chastises and curses and does untold all this damage - merely to avoid being seen as a bit of a liar or a hypocrite - and you are all right with this? This sounds like a credulous, compelling argument for a benevolent, loving, paternalistic god with only the best interests of humanity at heart?
In all honesty, goodlife - your faith is demonstrably irrational. I might let you buy me a beer, but I would never in a million years let you anywhere near the levers of power....
"Kromovaracun-Look at it this way, if you warn your child not to touch the hot flame because he will get burned – what is the consequence if he ignores the warning?
The consequences are that the child gets burnt, to what extent we do not know. And the child is likely to learn by experience - often a far more powerful teaching aid :)
It is the same with Jehovah. He gives a warning that failure to do (or not do) something brings punishment in one way or another therefore it is necessary for him to fulfil that punishment, otherwise he could be classed a liar!"
Heaven forfend that he might be a liar! In order to avoid that ignominy he smites and chastises and curses and does untold all this damage - merely to avoid being seen as a bit of a liar or a hypocrite - and you are all right with this? This sounds like a credulous, compelling argument for a benevolent, loving, paternalistic god with only the best interests of humanity at heart?
In all honesty, goodlife - your faith is demonstrably irrational. I might let you buy me a beer, but I would never in a million years let you anywhere near the levers of power....
"It is the same with Jehovah. He gives a warning that failure to do (or not do) something brings punishment in one way or another therefore it is necessary for him to fulfil that punishment, otherwise he could be classed a liar! "
So one person touches the Ark of the Covenant, and thousands of people who have nothing to do with the action are murdered for miles around.
Or what about the passage in 2 Samuel 21, where Yahweh strikes Israel with a 3-year famine (killing thousands) and is only appeased when David has Saul's family butchered? Or where he murders Aaron's sons in Leviticus 10: 1-2 for offering incense that God didn't like?
What about that time where God murders David's child, slowly and horribly, over the course of several days, because David committed adultery? (Only then to spare Solomon, who is born of the same woman).
In none of these cases has Yahweh killed in anything like a proportional measure to the offense made against him - in most of them, he just kills people who happen to have been standing around the same place.
Plus, what about the reasons he chooses to kill people? In the case of Korah, all he does is criticise Moses. To any sensible modern person, this is not an executable offence, and certainly isn't the first resort of anyone with an iota of love or compassion.
So one person touches the Ark of the Covenant, and thousands of people who have nothing to do with the action are murdered for miles around.
Or what about the passage in 2 Samuel 21, where Yahweh strikes Israel with a 3-year famine (killing thousands) and is only appeased when David has Saul's family butchered? Or where he murders Aaron's sons in Leviticus 10: 1-2 for offering incense that God didn't like?
What about that time where God murders David's child, slowly and horribly, over the course of several days, because David committed adultery? (Only then to spare Solomon, who is born of the same woman).
In none of these cases has Yahweh killed in anything like a proportional measure to the offense made against him - in most of them, he just kills people who happen to have been standing around the same place.
Plus, what about the reasons he chooses to kill people? In the case of Korah, all he does is criticise Moses. To any sensible modern person, this is not an executable offence, and certainly isn't the first resort of anyone with an iota of love or compassion.
Slight correction to the above. God does not kill thousands of people for one person looking into the Ark. He kills 50,000 people because someone looked inside it. (1Samuel 6:19).
He also, however, kills Uzzah, because he put out his hand to stop the Ark falling off its cart when the oxen pulling it stumbled. (2 Samuel 6:1-7 1 Chr 13:9-10)
I still have trouble viewing this as a loving action.
He also, however, kills Uzzah, because he put out his hand to stop the Ark falling off its cart when the oxen pulling it stumbled. (2 Samuel 6:1-7 1 Chr 13:9-10)
I still have trouble viewing this as a loving action.
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