The Brexit Lecture By Kenneth Clarke.

[vetuste_ennemi]

Anybody watched it? You can't keep a good man down, can you?

Did you catch the finer points? Arguing against the populist "reclaiming our sovereignty" position NHS health reform Ken pointed out that our treaty with Nato commits us to wage war by a joint decision - a pretty serious commitment and surrender of autonomous decision. By analogy, he suggests, the EU "treaty" terms which commit us to selling food which doesn't poison our trading partners, and at the same time commits them to selling us toasters which don't explode in our faces is a similarly useful and mutually advantageous surrender, or (Ken's preferred term) "pooling")of sovereignty.

[dannyk13]

A dyed in the wool remainer so hardly a balanced viewpoint.

[Khandro]

Does he still wear Hush-Puppies? in fact, can you still buy Hush-Puppies?

[vetuste_ennemi]

...for Khandro - and nothing to do with the thread, but I hope others might enjoy:

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[vetuste_ennemi]

...the two women are as smart, but sounder and funnier than Ken.

Beattie doing her Oscar acceptance speeches is delicious.

[ToraToraTora]

No surprise, KenC has always been an arch federalist. Same as St Tony, I think they are just getting desperate to save their dream. I can understand that.

[Old_Geezer]

Wasn't aware we intended to sell poisoned food, nor exploding toasters, anyway. Did we have to get NATO agreement to push the invaders out of the Falklands ?

[jim360]

I don't know if support was technically required as a matter of international law, but what certainly is true is that the UK enjoyed a lot of financial and military support from allies, without which winning the war would certainly have been rather less likely.

I've not seen the lecture, and can't say I intend to, so you'd have to clarify what Ken said about the Falklands in order for me to comment any more than that.

As to the general speech... well, he would say that, wouldn't he? But then, when prominent Leave Supporters come out and claim that the EU is going to collapse within a generation, it seems to be accepted without much question. It's hard to separate vested interests from an argument, but it's worth at least trying to regardless of what side the arguer is taking.

[Old_Geezer]

Not so much accepted, save as a possibility, more a case of not needing to comment on wishful thinking.

[jim360]

I'm not sure I understand what that's in reference to.

[-Talbot-]

I haven't read what Ken has said during the lecture in question so I'm not even sure he mentioned the Falklands ...but I know what Ken said in 1982.