Underpinning Societal And Personal Values?

[Theland]

What do you believe underpins western societal values?
Whatever it is, if anything, is it the same as underpins your own personal values?

[david small]

Remember we are all equals, just that some are more equal than others. Give as you would like to be given to.
Cherish the animal kingdom for that was the path you once trod. These things are instinctive, yet deliberately ignored by the desire for money.

[Theland]

As Devils Advocate, (from now on DA), what is wrong in the perfectly rational idea that I do what I want and take what I can and the devil take the hindmost?

[jackthehat]

Will you be musing on your own self-determined morality allowing you to not work and to steal......etc., etc.....?

[nailit]

//what is wrong in the perfectly rational idea that I do what I want and take what I can//
I know that ur playing devils advocate here but I cant think of many people that would say that doing and taking what you want is perfectly rational.

[sandyRoe]

That's the rule for powerful countries rather than individuals.
At one time England, now the USA, soon China.

[Theland]

DA - Yes it is rational. It's what lions do in the wild.

[nailit]

Humans arnt lions BUT like lions we work best for survival when we work together, that why its not rational to take (or do) just what we want.

[Theland]

Yes it is rational.
How many thieves in prison are only sorry they got caught?

[nailit]

Thieves in prison (like lions in the wild) are dealt with by the rest of the pack if they threaten the packs best interest.

[nailit]

That's why its not rational to just do what you want....it threatens both ur own survival and the packs survival.

[jourdain2]

For me it is underpinned by basically Christian values. Help others as much as you can; do no harm to anyone; support your community and help those who need help; put yourself and your needs second and think through your own actions to see how they are compatible with your beliefs. In my case I also worship the Lord Jesus and try to keep the church going. This is a very difficult question when you go into it. I have a horrible feeling that current Western values are more 'me' based - the 'selfie' culture.

It makes for a very unstable feeling so far as I am concerned. I spent 2 days at Alton Towers last week (pre-booked for grandkids and marriage is breaking-up so I stepped in) I hated almost every moment except for interaction with daughter and kids. People were so self-obsessed, seeking gratification and isolated. I suppose that makes me old fashioned. OK., so be it.

[DTCwordfan]

now to send Theland into apoplexy....the answer is Judaism - a long time around before any notions of Clhristianity - and surprise, surprise, the OT underpins the Torah and the Koran.....hence the tri-Abrahamic religions - one God, one hundred disciples and a thousand wars later.

Thank God that atheism = realism.

[Theland]

DTC - not very clear my friend.

[nailit]

Theland arnt you playing DA with me anymore?
Do you concur that its not rational to just do what you want....it threatens both ur own survival and the packs survival?

[sandyRoe]

Do atheists not go to war?

[Theland]

Nailit - Bankers do it all the time. They get away with it, and if they don't, all they get is a nasty headline.
So rationally, if you are in a position to do do so, why not grab and go and laugh all the way to the bank?
Self interest and sod the rest of you is the way to go is it not?
After all, self interest underpins this persons interests.
Yes?

[jourdain2]

Theland, not everyone is like that - I agree that self-interest seems to predominate these days but of course I can't speak for what values were 100 years ago.

[nailit]

//Self interest and sod the rest of you is the way to go is it not?//
No its not. We all know about greedy bankers but you are forgetting billions of other people who look out for each other. Look out for their family, neighbours, friends, strangers etc

[sandyRoe]

Most laws are designed to make us , the man/woman in the street , feel secure.
Mug a granny and the world will be outraged. Be a banker and make mistakes and the government will bail you out

[Theland]

Nailit - Agree with you, but, I am asking you what underpins it and what underpins the billions who are self serving ?