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Why didn’t God make his original message clear?
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Since Jesus arrived on earth with his new message, many ‘prophets’ have surfaced - Mohammed, Joseph Smith, and Charles Taze Russell, to name but a few – and the millions that follow these people are all convinced that their own brand of religion is right. Since logically they can't possibly all be right, there is undoubtedly still much confusion, so wouldn’t it have been more sensible of God to dispose of the necessity for new prophets by making his message absolutely clear in the first place?
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Khandro //How is the 'Word of God' as postulated by Islam (via the prophet Mohammad) an interpretation of biblical texts? //
The Muslims concur with the Old Testament.
Also don't forget that Mohammed (pbuh)didn't invent Islam. Islam was the first and only true religion. Mohammed (pbuh) just revealed how the Hebrews and Christians had strayed from His truth.
The Muslims concur with the Old Testament.
Also don't forget that Mohammed (pbuh)didn't invent Islam. Islam was the first and only true religion. Mohammed (pbuh) just revealed how the Hebrews and Christians had strayed from His truth.
The OT and the Muslim stories come from the same oral traditions. These are just ancient Arab myths and intimately tangled with the Egyptian myths.
Abraham is the hero to both Muslim and the Judeo-Christians for being willing to sacrifice his son to their god.
They both believe in Adam and Eve as the fist humans.
They both applaud the same fascist ideology, the ultimate glorious destruction of Armageddon.
Indeed the Muslim are closer to the Christians than the Jews in that they accept Christ as a prophet.
Abraham is the hero to both Muslim and the Judeo-Christians for being willing to sacrifice his son to their god.
They both believe in Adam and Eve as the fist humans.
They both applaud the same fascist ideology, the ultimate glorious destruction of Armageddon.
Indeed the Muslim are closer to the Christians than the Jews in that they accept Christ as a prophet.
Beso: I have pasted this in from Wikipedia "Western secular scholars have tended to analyse similarities between Biblical and Quranic accounts of the same person or event as being evidence for the influence of pre-existing traditions on the composition of the Qur'an. This has been denied by Muslims. From a traditionalist Muslim perspective, such a discussion would make no sense; Muslims believe that the Qur'an was sent from Allah (God) through the angel Jibrael (Gabriel) to the prophet Muhammad in a series of revelations, and this divinely inspired text was then progressively dictated (word for word, and over and over again to make certain that there were no mistakes) by Muhammad to the followers of Islam. Moreover, they believe that the Biblical tradition was corrupted over time, and hence it would be futile to use it as a basis for any sort of comparison with the allegedly infallible revelation of the Qur'an."
I admit that I haven't read the Koran, only bits from it, but it seems to me that as long as Muslims find no offence in a biblical text they are prepared not to condemn it. But this is not the same as saying that they are a basis for their religion.
I shall be playing golf this weekend with a devout (educated) Muslim friend,
and I will enquire further.
I admit that I haven't read the Koran, only bits from it, but it seems to me that as long as Muslims find no offence in a biblical text they are prepared not to condemn it. But this is not the same as saying that they are a basis for their religion.
I shall be playing golf this weekend with a devout (educated) Muslim friend,
and I will enquire further.
What muslims like to believe about the origins of their religion is irrelevant to what it's origins are. They believe it is the revealed word of god, most intelligent people are inclined to be sceptical about that explanation. It seems to me as a non biblical scholar that two similar stories originating in the same part of the world at approximately the same time might have had the same origins, why wouldn't they? You can rewrite history as often as you like but you won't alter the facts. The opinion of an educated muslim on the origins of his religion is probably as relevant as his opinion of the origin of the universe.
I agree with what you say jomifl, and further, there would be little point in asking a devout Muslim from where came is religion (where it's going would be more interesting!) because the answer is bound to be as I quoted above, - It
came directly from Allah, via the conduit of Mohammad', full stop, end of story.
I shall enquire though, what relevance, if any, the biblical old testament has to him. I suspect though, I already know the answer.
It's amazing what breadth of discussion one finds on the golf-course.
came directly from Allah, via the conduit of Mohammad', full stop, end of story.
I shall enquire though, what relevance, if any, the biblical old testament has to him. I suspect though, I already know the answer.
It's amazing what breadth of discussion one finds on the golf-course.
Hi Khandro, what might be an interesting line of enquiry would be that if as Beso says Islam existed before Mohammed, who was the conduit for god's word? If not, why are the koranic teachings so similar to the Hebrew teachings if they are not based on god's word? I await the result of your golf game with interest and wish you luck.
Khandro, //Differing religious beliefs may be right for different societies and different times, just as rules of law may vary, but are appropriate for the given circumstances. //
Regardless of what suits society, truth is not an option. If any of these people have it right, it can only possibly be one of them.
//How is the 'Word of God' as postulated by Islam (via the prophet Mohammad) an interpretation of biblical texts? //
There can be no doubt that Mohammed based the Koran on earlier works - notably those of the Greeks - but almost exclusively on the bible - with a bit of ancient Jewish folklore thrown in. Your Wiki link states:
//Western secular scholars have tended to analyse similarities between Biblical and Quranic accounts of the same person or event as being evidence for the influence of pre-existing traditions on the composition of the Qur'an. This has been denied by Muslims. From a traditionalist Muslim perspective, such a discussion would make no sense; //
Of course they would say it makes no sense to them because it’s not what they want to believe and it‘s not what they want other people to believe. They prefer to ignore the reality of historical fact by claiming that all the biblical prophets - including Moses and Jesus - were Muslim - and that Islam has existed since time began - but they weren’t - and it hasn’t. Islam was invented by Mohammed 1500 years ago.
Regardless of what suits society, truth is not an option. If any of these people have it right, it can only possibly be one of them.
//How is the 'Word of God' as postulated by Islam (via the prophet Mohammad) an interpretation of biblical texts? //
There can be no doubt that Mohammed based the Koran on earlier works - notably those of the Greeks - but almost exclusively on the bible - with a bit of ancient Jewish folklore thrown in. Your Wiki link states:
//Western secular scholars have tended to analyse similarities between Biblical and Quranic accounts of the same person or event as being evidence for the influence of pre-existing traditions on the composition of the Qur'an. This has been denied by Muslims. From a traditionalist Muslim perspective, such a discussion would make no sense; //
Of course they would say it makes no sense to them because it’s not what they want to believe and it‘s not what they want other people to believe. They prefer to ignore the reality of historical fact by claiming that all the biblical prophets - including Moses and Jesus - were Muslim - and that Islam has existed since time began - but they weren’t - and it hasn’t. Islam was invented by Mohammed 1500 years ago.
Charles Taze Russell never claimed to a prophet, and plainly stated that he was not a prophet. Russell sought, through study of the Bible itself, to reclaim the message of the Bible itself. The Bible itself, properly understood, explains why there is so much religious confusion, and why the Bible itself contains mysteries that are not understood by the world at the present time. Jesus is the prophet of out time through whom the God of Abraham speaks. (Exodus 3:14,15; Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Acts 3:13-26; Hebrews 1:1,2) This last prophet Jesus speaks to us through the apostles. (The word "prophet" can also mean public speaker) This is what Russell taught.
Russell also showed from the Bible why the Bible is full of secrets, and why there is so much religious confusion.
The JWs, however, have rejected much that Russell taught, and have replaced it with an "organization" gospel of bad tidings of great woe of eternal destruction in their idea of Armageddon for most of the peoples of the Earth. Media URL: http://youtu.be/lxWueyQuzSw
Description:
Russell also showed from the Bible why the Bible is full of secrets, and why there is so much religious confusion.
The JWs, however, have rejected much that Russell taught, and have replaced it with an "organization" gospel of bad tidings of great woe of eternal destruction in their idea of Armageddon for most of the peoples of the Earth. Media URL: http://youtu.be/lxWueyQuzSw
Description:
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