Can God Be Known ?

[modeller]

I was asked this question yesterday.
My reaction was: What do you mean by 'known ' and how do we really 'know' anybody ?
What do you think ?

[mikey4444]

Not sure what is meant by "know" As an Atheist, gods of any type and flavour can't and don't exist, except in the minds of people. Perhaps they think they "know" their god ? Its harmless enough I suppose.

[jim360]

I don't know if the existence or not of God is that relevant to the question, because it is possible to "know", or conceive of, ideas that turn out not to be real and explore them in great depth. That aside, I think the answer has to depend on how much you need to know about something before you "know" that thing. By most religious arguments God cannot ever be fully known as He is meant to be beyond us. But some of His works we can clearly know to some extent, so I'd say that we can know God, at least partly, through His works. If so that would suggest that we could then test the existence of God in some way. For if you can know His work, you can also know when it isn't there, and compare the two.

I think a while back I made a similar point, along the lines of: "If God is unknowable, then so are God's works, in which case we couldn't tell whether or not He existed, in which case we could just as easily assume that He doesn't exist, in which case He is irrelevant."

[goodlife]

Many people know about Gods. you may live in communities where most citizens claim to believe that he exists.

But does this mean that they really know God? Well, there is a difference in knowing about the ruler of the country where one lives and in having a personal acquaintance with him. So, too, with knowing God. (Gal. 4:9)

[mikey4444]

zzzzzzzzzzz

[jomifl]

Since there appear to be as many gods as there are believers then I imagine that each believer 'knows' their god intimately, at least as well as the pope does (apparently).

[sandyRoe]

I don't know. But I like to think he knows us.

[RATTER15]

How can anybody know anybody that doesn't exist, apart from in their own minds.

[modeller]

I think you can only get to ' know ' somebody' through their actions and deeds either first hand or third hand but with God that's difficult . All I 'know' about our Abrahamic God is what is written in our bible especially the OT.
I had a vicar as a nice friendly neighbour some years ago but the more I got to know him the more I realised he was a bully especially towards his wife. Which raises the point can you 'know ' God through his reps. on earth.

[redman41]

This might be a useful site ! :-))

http://www.godtalkstoyou.com/

[cupid04]

He lives, he lives
Christ Jesus lives today
He walks with me and talks with me
Along life's narrow way
He lives, he lives
Salvation to impart
You ask me how I know he lives?
He lives within my heart!

[One of my favourite choruses!]

[mibn2cweus]

//Can God Be Known ?//

Do you mean like to 'know' him, like in the biblical sense? That might go a long ways towards explaining the 'Big Bang'.

[goodlife]

I find it is not unusual to find many such as religious icons decorating the home or the office of someone who claims to be an atheist.

Sincere Christians, however, do not forget the primary purpose of the icon. It is an object of worship. While Christians do not challenge the right of others to own icons, personally they do not have icons in their possession, even as collector’s items. This in harmony with the principle found at Deuteronomy 7:26,

[modeller]

redman I have read /watched your site but I find the problem of communicating with God at any level is he never answers . When God is asked directly by prayers they are never answered in a provable way.
According to the Vatican less than 1% reach their criteria as being answered . They quote 7 claims out of 4 million prayers over 20 years at Lourdes. Even a devout theist couldn't claim that as talking to God or if it is , its rather one sided.

Cupid I'm glad it makes you happy but how can you say you ' know ' God.

jim // I'd say that we can know God, at least partly, through His works. // Which works did you have in mind ? Maybe I could quote them to my friend

[jim360]

Well since there aren't any that I can see, I can't think of a specific example. In a sense the idea is hypothetical. Imagine that we had shown definitively that the Universe was self-contained and needed no Creator, nor could it have had one -- or, equally, imagine the exact opposite. Then we can "know" God through His creation, or know that he isn't there because he is unnecessary. Rather like Paley and the watch, really. That "proof" of God breaks down because what it ends up saying is that God can't make watches, but the idea is still reasonable, I think. If you found a watch, you would at least know that whoever made it was capable of achieving something like that. If you found that the Universe had to have a creator then you would know something of that Creator's abilities. We aren't at that point, yet, and perhaps never will be, as there is still much to understand about how the Universe works.

More easily of course, since God is meant to be able to work miracles, then we can know of him through any such miracles. But there's no sign of these in the modern world, and such stories are there are tend to be from people who don't fully understand what they saw.

So those are the works I have in mind. Not seeing God, but seeing His influence somehow, and when we do see it, see it in a way that cannot now or ever be explained otherwise.

[naomi24]

Your question assumes that a god exists - and if one does the answer is no.

[modeller]

If God exists that's the key question.
That's the point // if he exists // what means do we have to 'know ' him ?
Prayers don't work . The OT tells us a lot , good and bad , but every word in the bible is written by man , not GOD so that has little value.
It boils down to personal experience and what we know of the world neither of which , good or bad , can be positively attributed to a God.

Our emotional knowledge is therefore based on our wishes and fears from which we make assumptions.
So until we are able to positively and directly communicate with God we can never 'know ' him. You could say the ball is in his court.

The majority view to the OP is NO! with some reservations. Thanks I will pass it on.