Belief Is Not A Choice

[nailit]

Our beliefs (or non-beliefs even) are based upon our present understanding of available evidence at any given moment in time.

I don't believe in fairies because I am not presented with any evidence (at this moment in time) that would satisfy me that fairies exist. That could change if evidence became apparent, or even a possibility!
Likewise for Unicorns, Thor, the Bermuda Triangle or Dracula.

So the question is, how can I believe in something that I evidently *CAN'T* believe in?
I dont dismiss the Bible/God/Christianity etc because I WANT to. I dismiss it all because I CAN'T.
What is so hard to understand?

What would make an atheist a believer?
I dont know. But an Almighty, Supreme being would know. And he hasn't showed up yet to convince me....

[naomi24]

Fake news, Theland. Strange that you’ve not asked where you can find confirmation that Isaiah 45.7 means what it says. I guess you would rather not know.

[jim360]

"It says what it says" is a circular argument that's going to persuade nobody. As far as I can see you're just rejecting any and all commentary that discusses how the interpretation of that passage is more subtle than you're giving it credit for because... well I'm not sure, really.

I can't take seriously the suggestion that any given single passage in the Bible can be taken to undermine Christianity (or likewise for other Holy Books). As seen in the other thread Nailit recently started, it's clear that he and others seem to think so, and so also think that many Christians are ignorant of their Holy Book, but I'm not convinced that's either fair or reasonable.

[naomi24]

The discussion has moved on.

[Theland]

Says the self appointed expert.

[pixie374]

Jim, the bizarre thing is, that it seems to be believers who claim the bible undermines their beliefs. I wasn't expecting that as a response, at all.

[jim360]

Is it? Surely ex-believers? Or have I missed something?

[pixie374]

No, i think you have. If you look through nailit's thread, the people most negative about an atheist reading the bible and seeing it as "ammunition" are all believers.

[pixie374]

"Ammunition against them..."

[jim360]

I'm not sure I agree with that interpretation. Questioning Nailit's motives for wanting to read the Bible -- ie, implying that he wants to gain ammunition -- isn't the same as suggesting that he actually *would* gain such ammo.

[naomi24]

I was right then, Theland. You’d rather not know. :o)

[pixie374]

It is. If you have conviction in what you believe, you would welcome others looking into it. There seems to be an awful lot of nervousness and dislike of the idea of nailit rereading the bible. That makes no sense.

[naomi24]

Jim, be assured, he would.

Night all.

[pixie374]

My point really, was that believers think he would.

[jim360]

Maybe they are being aggressive because, in announcing his goal to read the thing from cover to cover, he announced that it was "sick, immoral", and then also boring and irrelevant. Perhaps they should turn the other cheek and all, but if your Holy Book is described in terms that would be just as suitable for 120 Days of Sodom I can't say I'm surprised at the aggression in kind.

Time was when I would have agreed with Nailit's attitude but on reflection it's neither helpful nor even accurate. I don't agree that a surface reading of the Bible, especially one motivated by distrust, can ever be enough to undermine what is, ultimately, a deeply personal matter.

None of this is to say that I believe in a God, Christian or otherwise. I just don't see the point in being a dick about that.

[pixie374]

No, me neither. Each to their own. But a mistrust of somebody's motivations won't faze somebody with enough conviction and these threads often come across that believers just really aren't sure at all.
Taking it as it is, as we probably should... I would still expect the response to be mostly ... yes, read it...

[Theland]

Naomi - ?

[naomi24]

Yes?

[Theland]

What are you talking about, " Rather not know?"

[naomi24]

Theland, read my post at 22:34 Wed 26th Feb 2020 - all of it.