Alien Intervention

[luna-tic]

If people from another world (in a hypothetical situation) visited Earth and told us they were involved in this planets creation,evolution, they know the God or creative spirit and even knew the true story behind Jesus. Would we listen?, Would the devoutly religious denounce them and their stories as evil? Would the sceptics who didn't believe in intelligent life on other planets still not accept the visitors information?
I know, as I have said many a time before,"Who created God?" or "Who created the beings that could be our gods?" Mmm....Tricky one.

[naomi24]

Clanad, I think it's a mistake to assume, and to state as fact, that life on other planets would evolve at the same rate as life on earth. Regardless of the age of various planetary systems, we can't assume anything, because we simply don't know. There may well be younger suns out there with planets younger than the earth orbiting them, but it doesn't necessarily follow that life on those planets would be less evolved than life on earth. As for vast distances, again we can't assume that at sometime in the future ways won't be found to conquer them - and neither should we assume that others haven't already done that. Luna is spot on in saying we judge by what we know, because we do, and therefore we find it impossible to imagine anything outside our own tunnel vision. Where science is concerned, I believe we are mere infants who still have much to discover - and much to learn.

[Clanad]

Thanks for the rejoinder, naomi24... problem is, in my opinion, we are very sure that the laws of physics that exist here on Earth and govern our existence and make things predictable are universal. That is, the Second law of Thermodynamics, (the quality of matter/energy deteriorates gradually over time) as an example, is equally true on Alpha Centauri as it is here. This is astounding if one thinks about it. It has led to the understanding that the Universe is finite... it had a beginning, which, in my opinion, is one of the greatest and literally Earth-shaking discoveries ever!
So, that being said, the "evolution" of species at a greater rate than theorized here on our planet would be in violation of not only laws of physics, but also Darwinian explantions, time being the key ingredient.

(Contd.)
(The system doesn't like longer answers)

[Clanad]

(Contd.

Look, the point I'm trying to make is that there are very few, if any, other planetary systems that fit the over 300 specific characteristics necessary for any life to arise, much less "evolve". Heck, we can't even postulate in any reasonable manner how life began here on Earth, but the conditions for life were so finely tuned as to be exclusionary (universally, in my opinion) to any other place. Even if I'm wrong, the chances of any advanced species actually reaching Earth from the nearest neighboring galaxy are nil. The time required, even at the speed of light, exceeds the age of any galactic system plus the time required for development of an advanced species.
We may well be "mere infants" as far as science is concerned, but we do understand the basics and those, as I've said, are universal in nature...

[luna-tic]

If we can't even postulate how life began on Earth then why are scientists theories of physics (I say `theory ' because these laws are bound by human experience only) so restraining, so confined?
It's almost like the knowledgeable stating, "This is the way things are and always will be because we don't know any different at this time in our evolvement".
We've even proved ourselves wrong regarding certain cemented, what we thought were facts pertaining to ancient human beginnings.

[naomi24]

Clanad, with all due respect, I believe your vision is blinkered. I understand that you are probably reluctant to truly objectively consider possibilities that fall outside your beliefs, and outside that which you wish to believe, but all life forms do not survive and evolve in conditions that science once deemed necessary to sustain life. Creatures have been discovered thriving on earth in vastly alien conditions, and therefore we cannot say that we 'understand the basics' or that they are 'universal in nature'. Quite clearly, we don't - and they're not. If that is so, then what is there to preclude life existing elsewhere in the universe in what we would consider the most inhospitable, and even 'impossible', conditions?

As for space travel, an earth-like planet, thought capable of sustaining life, and only 20 light years distant, was recently discovered. 20 light years is indeed a vast - and, at the moment - an impossible distance, but I believe we will, someday, discover a way to conquer such distances - and more - and once we have, such a journey could be easily achieved in one man's lifetime. It may be impossible now, but that doesn't mean it will be impossible in the future. Only a century or so ago we were convinced that a train travelling at more than about 20 miles an hour would mean certain death to its passengers - and air travel was considered an absolute impossibility. 500 years hence (if we haven't blown ourselves to smithereens in the meantime), man will look back at 21st century science and laugh - just as we do when we look back at 19th century science.

continued.....

[naomi24]

..... continued

Additionally, you say that we are very sure that the laws of physics that exist here on earth and govern our existence are universal, but I wonder if we should be quite so sure? We were convinced that it was impossible for life to survive in alien conditions, but we were wrong - just as we were wrong about our rail passengers and our aeroplanes.

How can we say that other civilisations on other worlds have not already discovered the secret of space travel - and how can we say that someone, somewhere, didn't do just that millions of years ago? We are heading in that direction now, and although it's difficult for us to do otherwise, I think it's a great error to judge time or the potential of science, or nature, by human standards. The thought may be impossible to comprehend, but where science is concerned, man is only just beginning to learn. No one knows what secrets the future holds - yet!

[naomi24]

Luna, thanks so much for posting this question - what an interesting discussion this is. Fascinating stuff.

[luna-tic]

Thank you Naomi,
I'm not totally sure but I think I read somewhere about a new type of craft (looks like a giant doughnut) being developed in Oxford. This is going to use no fossil fuels but a type of huge electro-magnet. The researchers were claiming it may even be able to travel through space at hyper-speeds. I'm no scientist so I'm sure I'll be corrected at a later date but doesn't this type of flight and craft remind you and definitely me of the images of our alien visitors ships?
Mmm...wonder where they got that idea from?

[naomi24]

Good morning Luna. I haven't heard about this, but it sounds very exciting. Have you got a link?

[luna-tic]

Hello again Naomi,
I saw the article about the craft in a science magazine which was brought to my attention by a teacher while I was in work about a month ago. Do you think I can remember the name of the book?......er....no (what a twit).
I spent most of yesterday trying to find any link I could via the web without any success.
I would of told you this sooner but AB took five minutes to load each page.
Anyway I'll continue to search or ask the teacher when I return to the school.
Sorry, I'm not much use but I found the discussion exciting.

[naomi24]

Hi Luna, I'd be interested in reading about it if you do manage to find it, but not to worry if you can't. I don't for one moment imagine that man has reached the apex of knowledge where science is concerned, and I think that experiments of this nature will continue. There's no doubt we still have much to discover and much to learn. Isn't it exciting?!!!!