Is there a shareware programming language?

[Rev. Green]

Do you know of a cheap programming language, for a computer running Windows XP, which has graphics and can handle mouse and keyboard?

Liberty BASIC is almost suitable, but I can't see how to handle mouse input - and the full version isn't cheap.

[fo3nix]

I would never, ever consider using a programming language you have to pay for.

If you're prepared to invest a little time, I can recommend both Python and Ruby.

They're quite similar languages, with quite similar target audiences.

Both have decent packages for graphics (check out Shoes for Ruby, for instance), and both have libraries for mouse and keyboard input.

[fo3nix]

Some links:

http://cgkit.sourceforge.net/
http://docs.python.org/library/turtle.html

http://shoooes.net/

[Rev. Green]

Thanks for these. I'll try to install one. If you have the patience I'd appreciate some spoon-feeding of the form "you need this, this, and this". I started to install Python but was asked if I wanted cgkit python or maya python.

I'm quite happy with any language - Assembler, Pascal, C++, Fortran, PL/1 etc. (but not LISP) - but I'm hopeless at installing things in Windows and I don't want to clutter the thing with too many false starts.

[fo3nix]

I'm a ruby guy myself, with only a passing knowledge of python. And unfortunately too, a mac and Linux user.

However, I did install python on windows some years ago. I think I just grabbed the standard exe from the website and you get a compiler as well as intepreter.

You may be better with python, depending on what you're doing. It's faster, has a compiler, and (perhaps arguably) can be linked to C modules easier (for when you need real low level control).

There's a great book called Dive Into Python by Mark Pilgrim, available online for free as well as an actual book.

But sure, ask away. If I can help I will do.

(Ps. Try lisp again someday. It really is great.)

[Gormless]

My very favourite language of all time is MUMPS (nowadays called M - and it is the engine underlying Intersystems Cache). I have never found any data challenge that couldn't be solved in M. I use it as others might use perl or shell scripts.

Now you mention LISP, there is an academic variant of this called SCHEME, and this has been used commercially in a flavour called Monk to drive what is (arguably) the best systems integration engine in the world. I love it!

[rojash]

Try this
http://cc.codegear.com/Free.aspx?id=24722

You can produce professional quality compiled Windows 32 bit GUI apps.

It's free

[Rev. Green]

Many thanks fo3nix and Gormless, I'll have another go at Python.

You've touched a nerve there fo3nix, I loved Macs in the early days - when they were all in with the screen. They always worked, no bugs, didn't get slower with use, a programme would still work with a later version of the system, etc. etc. Then my work switched to Windows rubbish and I lost touch with them. I've been thinking of installing Linux as I'm reasonably confident with it - Red Hat is called something different now I think. But I'll give Python a try before ditching Windows completely.

[Rev. Green]

Many thanks rojash. Our posts crossed, I didn't mean to exclude you from thanks in the previous answer.

[pbeach]

Rojash has given you an excellent link, and one I would have suggested - along with http://cc.codegear.com/Free.aspx?id=24724
Rojash suggests Delphi which uses ObjectPascal as its main language to build visual applications for Windows. Delphi is in fact incredibly popular and is used by millions of developers around the world. The link I gave is for C++ Builder, a product similar to Delphi except its language is C++, I suggest you have a look at them.

[Rev. Green]

Thanks pbeach, but when I followed the Delphi link I saw prices in the thousands of dollars. Is the trial version fully-functioned and unlimited in time? If so, why would anyone pay?

[fo3nix]

On Linux: Red Hat is still Rat Hat, but they also do an 'experimental' community distro called Fedora. Very nice.

If you do try Linux though, I'd recommend you try Ubuntu first; it usually has a little more polish than the rest (though Fedora and OpenSUSE are very close).

[Rev. Green]

Thanks fo3nix. I've given up with Python. It looks as though it would be great under Linux, but the Windows installation seemed to give me only the basic package. It was fine to use but I couldn't see how to include the module which handled the mouse (cursus, I think). All the documentation seemed to be Unix based. I did click on the Windows installation - honestly.

[fo3nix]

Why not give Ubuntu and Python a go together?

You can try out Ubuntu as a live CD (so does nothing bad to your Windows drive), or install it with Wubi, so that it acts as a file on your Windows partition.

[Rev. Green]

You are correct fo3nix, free Unix is the way ahead, but are the milliards of people with Windows machines all just checking their mail and playing games? Surely a few must want to write a programme?

[fo3nix]

I'm sure it does work perfectly well. Try this link:

http://www.richarddooling.com/index.php/2006/0 3/14/python-on-xp-7-minutes-to-hello-world/

Seems like ActivePython may be a decent way to use Python on Windows XP or Vista.

Other interesting links:
http://wiki.python.org/moin/BeginnersGuide/Dow nload

http://www.neuralwiki.org/index.php?title=Guid e_to_installing_Python_in_Windows_Vista

[rojash]

"when I followed the Delphi link I saw prices in the thousands of dollars"

The current commercial versions of Delphi go for between hundreds and thousands of dollars. The link should take you to the free version which is a complete working version of an earlier release, not a trial.