Addition to the Christmas question below.

[Andyvon]

I ran out of room for this last point.

Despite what people might think from the previous points, I'm not religious. However, I do respect those who believe and who live their lives accordingly. I think everyone must recognise and respect other peoples' cultures, differences, religions and lives. That's the only way different people will live side by side in peace and it's the failure to respect those inherent differences that has led to most of the wars, strife and suffering that's blighted human history up to the present day. That lack of respect also answers several of the other questions in this section.

Lets respect religions and those who believe and live their lives accordingly. That includes Christmas. It's not an excuse for a spending binge, a party or a p**s up.

[slinkycat]

Actually andy, the original pagan festival was a bit of a Fosters up, with gift giving involved too!

[Mamyalynne]

I was not trying to second guess your faith, but I think we hae to accept that Christmas has been adopted as a party/celebraton time for virtually all and therte is probably no going back from there. My eldest Grandson is autistic and tells me "Grandma you know Christmas is all about Jesus, but he likes us to get presents too!" He`s a love as are all my others but he hedges his bets,

Goodnight to you

Mamya

[slinkycat]

Fosters? oops I didnt edit my text, actually said grolsch!

[Andyvon]

I think it's very difficult if you do have children mamyalynne. I've never had any so it's obviously easier for me but I do see that people with children are under a massive expectation to produce presents and spend huge amounts of money. That's what I don't like more than anything. I was in business for years and I came across so many people who were struggling throughout the year. It upset me to see so many people I had come to know almost distraught near Christmas because they felt they had to spend money they didn't have in order to keep up with neighbours and other parents and society in general. My distaste is centred at the commercialisation of it all and the blackmail such people have to submit to. As I've said, we don't see Muslims or Jews acting like this. Christmas has always involved gift giving, which I believe comes from St. Nicholas secretly passing money into a convent which cared for children. But this concept of spending huge sums in the shops on lots of presents has only really come about since the arrival of the supoerstores in the 1950s. They should be ashamed of themselves.

[Andyvon]

I'll bet that was good fun every Midwinter Slinkycat.

[slinkycat]

Quite right, about the commercialism, and on a different note, hubby has told me today that he gets christmas day off this year, but will have to work it next year. Why? Because apparently the public demand that they need to buy chilled desserts on Boxing Day! FFS

[beso]

I will certainly never respect the promitive, amoral texts that form the basis of the Abrahamic faiths.
Nor will I respect those who eagerly anticipate the destruction to be wrought by Armageddon so that their particular flavour of monotheism will overrun the planet. I will tolerate them but I will not bear them in silence.

No, despite the supposedly modern enlightened view of religious tolerance we should not be expected to respect religion and the arrogant bigotry in embodies. These people have and continue to supress genuine enlightenment and only by speaking up can we hope to educate and protect young people from the sick indoctination perpetrated by the religious.

Religions, including Christianity, have a long history of brutal retribution against those who do not subscribe to their faith. Religious beliefs have driven the majority of conflicts throughout history. In parts of the world we now have an opportunity to make a difference and I will be speaking loudly against religion for as long as I can.

[123everton]

Good grief Beso, you must be a devil with the ladies and a boon at parties.
Yawn.
People of faith and belief (in spirituality too) and people of none need to focus on the things that tie them together rather than the things that set them apart.
If money's an issue why not habve a Spanish Christmas, they give the gifts out on the twelth day.