Barry Gibb Royal Variety Show

[Caribeing]

Need earplugs sounds like someone stamped on the cat!

[NellieMay]

Love Johnny Mathis, Jordy Boy. Another distinctive voice.

[hereIam]

He's done pretty well without him since he died Nellie.

[NellieMay]

Written and performed a lot of crap songs though since. Still relying on his Beatles fame.

[andy-hughes]

NellieMay - //Andy, it is not a fact that the Beatles influenced Cohen, Willy Nelson , the GIbbs or Neil Diamond. Sorry, but you are wrong on this. All great songwriters too. And I think McCartney is highly overrated as a songwriter and performer. He needed Lennon. //

I didn't say that they did.

What I said was, their music created a seismic shift in musical and artistic culture around the world. and any popular musician who followed them was indirectly or directly influenced by those changes - and they would all acknowledge that if you ask them. I know, I have asked many of them.

As to your opinion that McCartney is overrated as a songwriter and performer, on that we can agree to differ, no problem at all.

[hereIam]

I don't think he is relying on his old Beatles fame at all, that was a long, long time ago. I'm not particularly a fan by the way, just think your criticism is a bit unfair.

[andy-hughes]

hereIam - //I don't think he is relying on his old Beatles fame at all, that was a long, long time ago. I'm not particularly a fan by the way, just think your criticism is a bit unfair. //

As my posts show, I have absolutely no issue with anyone disliking the music of Paul McCartney, or indeed any other musician, but to state that he lacks a distinctive voice, musicality or talent, is simply not true.

[naomi24]

Credit where credit is due to Paul McCartney - he is a legend - but his voice these days is distinctive only in its 'awfulness'. He really should acknowledge that his public singing days are over.

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - //Credit where credit is due to Paul McCartney - he is a legend - but his voice these days is distinctive only in its 'awfulness'. He really should acknowledge that his public singing days are over. //

Can't gainsay that - but I refer to my post concerning the reluctance of stars to give up performing live, and the reluctance of their audience to let them - which means that inevitable 'shadow of his /her/their former self is an inevitable consequence as time marches on.

[naomi24]

Indeed. The roar of the greasepaint, the smell of the crowd ... and all that.

[andy-hughes]

That's it exactly.

But I do think the star musicians owe it to their own legend, and their fans, to stop when the time has come, and simply accept that they can't do it anymore.

The problem is, who is ever going to tell Paul McCartney that he can't hack it as a live performer?

[Garaman]

It seems a bit far-fetched to me, Andy, to claim that the likes of Willie Nelson would not have had a career in music were it not for The Beatles and their colleagues.

I have never really liked Paul McCartney's work away from The Beatles, but I accept he is a legend.

[andy-hughes]

Garaman - //It seems a bit far-fetched to me, Andy, to claim that the likes of Willie Nelson would not have had a career in music were it not for The Beatles and their colleagues. //

It's not a bit far-fetched Garaman - it's ludicrously far-fetched, which is why I didn't say it.

Willie Nelson was thirty years old when The Beatles emerged into the world - does he owe his career to them? Of course not.

Was the world in which Willie lives, composes, sings and performs irrevocably changed as a result of the impact of The Beatles on world music and culture? Yes it was.

That is the point I am making.

[Garaman]

Andy, you wrote //NellieMay - that's unfortunate, because all the artists you mention, and nay other artist from 1963 onwards, would not have a career in music without Mr McCartney and colleagues. // NellieMay mentioned Willie Nelson.

[andy-hughes]

Garaman - a fair point I concede that I didn't pick up Mr Nelson in her example - and you are quite right to challenge me on it - I stand corrected with apologies - and I hope that my last post singles out Mr Nelson as an exception insofar as his initial impetus to start a career in music.

[murraymints]

oi !! you leave Barry alone...he changed many a life with his brothers..and whatever he does is fine by me..AND ..he married a wummin from a few wee miles from here..he knows what's good....and Larry Nelson is above human reproach !

[NellieMay]

Thanks for your apology Andy. How about Cohen? And I forgot to mention Dylan

[NellieMay]

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/10/17/leonard-cohen-makes-it-darker

[andy-hughes]

NellieMay - had I been more careful with my response, I would have tailored it to include artists whose careers were post-Beatlemania.

But of course, no career exists in a vacuum - I am sure that the musicians who influenced The Beatles like Little Richard and Chet Atkins got a serious boost when fans started checking out the name-checked influences of the biggest pop group ever.