Broadband Encoding Conversion

[Old_Geezer]

Just curious. I could bore you with a tale of bring charged (twice) by BT for their inability to find a fault on their network; but this is more about the end result.

Trying to identify the cause of the atrocious phone/broadband service I was experiencing and which BT had already failed to correct for the third time, I initially tried to purchase a Smart Hub from BT (so they wouldn't be able to blame my router/modem) but I was talked into changing my contract, since the suggested new one came with that modem included, and it would be both faster and cheaper. I asked if my existing routers would still work, and was told, "Yes, but at a slower speed".

After the change I continued my testing. The phone had lost most of it's unacceptable level of "background" noise, and the broadband dropped out much more rarely; but since BT seemed to have blamed my routers and I've been convinced from the start that it was their network crosstalking the broadband and voice somewhere, I felt that trying the old routers on the new connection would help clarify things.

But they all refused to connect !

Looking at the router status page in seems to think I'm connected to "Infinity". But it turns out that "Infinity" encodes using VDSL whilst the older routers use ADSL. In other words I was lied to. And the older routers are no longer usable. At least not on my connection.

So I gave it some thought and wondered if there were such a thing as (inexpensive) ADSL to VDSL converters. Anyone know if they exist ? As it would allow me to continue using the older routers and confirm the problem was always in their network.

Cheers.

[Old_Geezer]

PS it's also interesting that new customers are offered a 12 month tie in, but a loyal existing customer is tied into an 18 month contract. What the heck is wrong with commercial concerns these days ?

[Fitzer]

Routers don't (normally) encode, sounds as if you have a combined modem/router (most hubs are). As such you should just be able to take an output from your Infinity box and plug it into the WAN port of a router.

[Old_Geezer]

Thanks, but I'm not following how this would help. You're suggesting that the Infinity box can act as converter ?

Ideally I'd want the Infinity router/modem out of the circuit and would have to tolerate a separate converter out of lack of another option.

It's difficult. I'm trying to find a way to prove that the original modem/routers don't have an issue; that the problems I complained of for months was finally solved by switching me over to a different circuit in the BT network. For my own satisfaction really but if I could get BT to reimburse both lots of money they took from me for their failing to find a fault on their network, that would be a bonus.

[bednobs]

i am a technical dunce, but what you are describing does sound very much like it was your routers as now you have been swapped it works

[sunny-dave]

VDSL and ADSL are different technologies - if your line now supports VDSL you must on a fibre circuit.

So - essentially you've been stitched up - BT has moved you to its 'fibre' service rather than the old 'copper wire' service which you were on.

It is faster, it may be cheaper, but you won't be able to use the old routers on it (at least not without using the infinity box as a primary router), and so can't prove what the fault on the old line was.

[Garaman]

I am not sure you have that quite right, SD, VDSL as far as I know is much faster than ADSL but still intended for twisted-pair copper wiring.

[Garaman]

OG, ADSL and VDSL are signalling methods, they aren't used for coding and encoding. ADSL is basically is a bunch of mini modems in one box all using different segments of the frequency range of the cable. So your digital data is chopped up and sent out as lots of analogue signals, then put together again a the other end. I don't know how VDSL works but imagine it isn't far different, just better. It seems BT is offering a better connection using the faster signalling method, so you wouldn't want to convert it back to the slower method.

[sunny-dave]

I was trying to keep it simple, garaman.

BT fibre (used by every supplier except Virgin) is branded by them as Infinity.

It uses FTTC (fibre to the cabinet) and then twisted copper to the property. VDSL gives the necessary fast speed between the property and the green cabinet so that the fibre speeds can be achieved by the user. ADSL just won't work in this configuration (at least not without some serious tweaking of the software/box by the user).

Essentially BT have changed the whole routing of OG's internet connection - even the bit from his house to the green cabinet has been re-plugged and re-terminated at each end. Thus making it virtually impossible for him to prove where the previous fault was.

[Garaman]

I see, SD, sorry I misunderstood.

[sunny-dave]

No probs and no need to apologise, garaman - I should explain properly the first time :)

SD

[Old_Geezer]

I doubt it was the routers, I had my usual one, my spare one, and at different times I borrowed my woman's Thomson one, and also her BT Smart Hub one, and they all had the same issues. Now they have changed the encoding the ADSL ones won't connect, but her Smart Hub and my new Smart Hub will, and the problems appear to be gone. Based on hers having the same issue as all the others on ADSL and not on VDSL I have to conclude the issue wasn't with the routers but fixed by the new connection.

Coding / Signalling, you may well be technically correct, but it all means much the same to me. Either a box can interpret the data in the form it arrives, or it can't. Trouble is whilst I've had two lots of £129.99 demanded of me, I'm convinced is was not for having an issue on my premises but because they weren't competent enough to find it on theirs. There's a lot I can do with £259.98, especially on a pension. If they'd really found something on my premises, which I don't believe, then surely the problem would have been fixed first time and the second (third in reality) visit wouldn't have been necessary.

[Old_Geezer]

Oh, and I take it a ASDL to VDSL/VDSL to ADSL converter isn't an option.

[sunny-dave]

It was almost certainly a dud connection either at your main socket, or at the 'green cabinet', or at the exchange.

Since all three of the connections have been replaced, and the link from the cabinet to the exchange is now a fibre one, it's not surprising that the fault has been cured - it's also extremely convenient for BT/Openreach that they've removed all possibility of proving what the exact nature of the fault was.

They are appalling shysters who have tried to stitch me up in the past. They failed - but only because my technical knowledge was as good as theirs. I spotted what they were up to and took some incontrovertible video/audio evidence of what the engineer did.

They will be first against the wall when the revolution comes ..

[Old_Geezer]

Cheers. At different times they changed the main socket, and the front of the main socket, to no permanent improvement.