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The EU are willing to delay a project and increase other member states costs just to prove a point that doesn’t need making.
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We might as well just trot off now rather than go begging for scraps from an organisation that would rather cut off its nose to spite its face.
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We might as well just trot off now rather than go begging for scraps from an organisation that would rather cut off its nose to spite its face.
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"For obvious reasons, the EU has limits on information and data it can share with third countries."
The reasons are not obvious to me. Perhaps you could spell them out to me. The UK shares enormous amounts of information and data (much of it highly classified) with the USA. But we are not a member of the USA.
The reasons are not obvious to me. Perhaps you could spell them out to me. The UK shares enormous amounts of information and data (much of it highly classified) with the USA. But we are not a member of the USA.
We have bespoke agreements to do that with the USA. (We're also, in my view, a satellite state of the US, but that's another debate). There's currently no agreement to do that between the UK and the EU, so that means we fall under the same restrictions of all other non-member states. They're obviously not going to be automatically sharing sensitive civil and military data with any non-member without a bespoke agreement to do so. If we want that, it's up to us to arrange it. Which, as far as we know, we haven't.
"They're obviously not going to be automatically sharing sensitive civil and military data with any non-member without a bespoke agreement to do so. If we want that, it's up to us to arrange it."
And presumably it will be in their interest and desirable for them to have access to our information. So why is it solely up to us? Brexit is a two way street.
And presumably it will be in their interest and desirable for them to have access to our information. So why is it solely up to us? Brexit is a two way street.
Because in this case it's the UK govt who wants the access. By default, we don't get it, because we won't be a member anymore, and we seem to be looking to change that.
If Brussels is also trying to negotiate access to our data, there's not any information in the public domain about it, so there isn't much to say about it.
If Brussels is also trying to negotiate access to our data, there's not any information in the public domain about it, so there isn't much to say about it.
Perhaps my outlook is with rose tinted glasses but I would rather that than be constantly rooting for the other side. And you have no idea of my employment status. So keep guessing.
Our exit in some, if not most areas, is not as straightforward as one would like but as an EU member for donkeys it beggars belief that the EU and some of our own think we are not trusted partners.
As I said earlier I think. That says it all.
Our resident remainers may or may not be right but they sure as hell put up a good show of not wanting or caring if the UK gets the best deal or even a good deal or in fact any deal.
Don’t you realise that the best deal is something to aim for? Something to want? Or are you so wrapped up in (misguided) pompous righteousness that you can’t see you are doing as much harm to the remain cause as the EU strategy? You, with your remaining adherence to the all encompassing status of the EU just prove to people we are better out than in. Because all you see are problems in extracting ourselves from the EU. All your spouting about the EU reiterates their inflexibility. And reinforces once out we are better able to be proactive and independent.
Every time you smugly say ‘you obviously don’t understand how tricky it is’ or ‘the EU have every right’ or the UK are the ones losing out or some such similar thing you help convince more people that leaving is the better thing to do.
And although it is sometimes tiresome having the same conversation it is heartening that you are helping the leave camp to swell.
Our exit in some, if not most areas, is not as straightforward as one would like but as an EU member for donkeys it beggars belief that the EU and some of our own think we are not trusted partners.
As I said earlier I think. That says it all.
Our resident remainers may or may not be right but they sure as hell put up a good show of not wanting or caring if the UK gets the best deal or even a good deal or in fact any deal.
Don’t you realise that the best deal is something to aim for? Something to want? Or are you so wrapped up in (misguided) pompous righteousness that you can’t see you are doing as much harm to the remain cause as the EU strategy? You, with your remaining adherence to the all encompassing status of the EU just prove to people we are better out than in. Because all you see are problems in extracting ourselves from the EU. All your spouting about the EU reiterates their inflexibility. And reinforces once out we are better able to be proactive and independent.
Every time you smugly say ‘you obviously don’t understand how tricky it is’ or ‘the EU have every right’ or the UK are the ones losing out or some such similar thing you help convince more people that leaving is the better thing to do.
And although it is sometimes tiresome having the same conversation it is heartening that you are helping the leave camp to swell.
Please don't mistake an honest assessment for pessimism. It's hard to look at any of how the last two years have panned out without seeing that many people have underestimated the problems both of leaving the EU in the first place, and of being out once that happens.
I've voiced before on AB (I think) that most of the problems could probably have been avoided if the referendum had been held *after* people had given a proper thought to what leaving would mean, rather than before. Instead we were offered a dishonest referendum, designed to kill the issue, and it backfired on, in particular, Cameron and Osborne's faces spectacularly. They ran away (or were sacked) before they could face up to the true fallout from their arrogance, but it still leaves behind a mess. I hope that May, Davis et al can sort things out, but they are running out of time and running out of ideas.
If, paradoxically, an increasingly dysfunctional plan for our future outside the EU encourages more people to support leaving, then so be it. The EU's intransigence may be unhelpful, but it's no more unreasonable than Jacob Rees-Mogg's bizarre and totally false insistence that "we hold all the cards" (unless he meant a Yarbrough, I suppose...), and rather better-supported by reality.
As it is, there's little evidence that, overall, public opinion has changed. Perhaps more people are flocking to leave, concerned by the EU's inflexibility, but, equally, "Regrexit" is pushing some back the other way. But mainly, if you hated the EU to start with you'll probably hate it even more now, and if you hated Leave to start with then the inability to come up with a coherent plan is going to convince you that you were right to have voted to stay in. We see what we want to see.
I've voiced before on AB (I think) that most of the problems could probably have been avoided if the referendum had been held *after* people had given a proper thought to what leaving would mean, rather than before. Instead we were offered a dishonest referendum, designed to kill the issue, and it backfired on, in particular, Cameron and Osborne's faces spectacularly. They ran away (or were sacked) before they could face up to the true fallout from their arrogance, but it still leaves behind a mess. I hope that May, Davis et al can sort things out, but they are running out of time and running out of ideas.
If, paradoxically, an increasingly dysfunctional plan for our future outside the EU encourages more people to support leaving, then so be it. The EU's intransigence may be unhelpful, but it's no more unreasonable than Jacob Rees-Mogg's bizarre and totally false insistence that "we hold all the cards" (unless he meant a Yarbrough, I suppose...), and rather better-supported by reality.
As it is, there's little evidence that, overall, public opinion has changed. Perhaps more people are flocking to leave, concerned by the EU's inflexibility, but, equally, "Regrexit" is pushing some back the other way. But mainly, if you hated the EU to start with you'll probably hate it even more now, and if you hated Leave to start with then the inability to come up with a coherent plan is going to convince you that you were right to have voted to stay in. We see what we want to see.
The paradox is, the more the government mess it up, the more people want to support a ‘ leave at any cost’ policy as a protest against said Govt.
Very strange times in politics and a classic example of why you shouldn’t indulge in referendums when a particular party, whom the populace have made a majority vote to...erm...govern.
Very strange times in politics and a classic example of why you shouldn’t indulge in referendums when a particular party, whom the populace have made a majority vote to...erm...govern.
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