Am I a bad person

[sarahbowen82]

I have a moral dilemna. A few months ago, I ordered a dining suite, and paid a �50 deposit to secure it. I was told that when the items were delivered I would be asked to pay the net amount. Last week the item was ordered and I left the cash with my OH as he was in on that day. The delivery man did not ask for the cash and being a little simple, my OH didnt remember the cash either. So as a result, I have paid �50 for a suite worth �700. ( I had even managed to tenaciously negotiate a �50 discount due to postponed delivery!!) That was last week, and since then, I have not heard anything from them. Should I tell them? Will they find out and demand the money? Has anything similiar happened to anyone out there, what is your advice?

[andy hughes]

They will find out, and they will demand the money. It's up to you whether you decide to make them wait, but since they have honoured their side of the contract, it would be the honourable thing for you to do the same.

That said, I would hang onto the money until they ask - better in your account than theirs.

[Morrisonker]

O.H? not sure what that means. Anways, I think that sooner or later they'll realise that you haven't paid, it'll be on a computer somewhere and I dare say it'd be very easy for them to find out. You could get in a bit of trouble if you say you've paid and you haven't so best thing to do would be to plead ignorance if they confront you and just cough up.

If it wasn't worth quite so much money then I'd say try and get away with it, but �700 is a substantial amount.

[maggie01]

O H. other half.......I would pay the money and then you can sleep at night, instead of worrying about it. Also you may spend the money and then they will come after you for the balance.

[lilyfrog]

It may well be they meant they would invoice you upon delivery, so an invoice could be in the post to you.

I know I wouldn't be able to relax thinking waiting for someone to claim the money

[Buenchico]

While you've obviously got no right to hold on to the money once they demand it, there's no (legal) obligation on you to chase after them so that you can make your payment. (I would also suggest that there's no moral obligation on you to assist them in running their business efficiently. If they can't sort out their invoicing procedures, why should you help them?).

Put the money to one side and start the clock running on the 6 years that they've got to claim their money. If they don't contact you within that time, then it'll be too late for them to pursue the debt.

Chris

[Clanad]

While usually nodding in agreement with Chris fine fellow, I'm afraid I have to disagree on both of his counts. Granted, I'm speaking from a point of view based on U.S. law, but assuming some similarities, the U.S. courts would find that sarah has entered into a binding contract. True, it's a verbal contract (res ipsa loquitur) in some parts, but binding nevertheless. She states that she was told, and apparently agreed to the fact that she would pay the balance owing at the time of delivery. At this point, the fact that company representative did not demand the payment didn't relieve her of her duty in paying the amount..
Secondly, the moral obligation is inherent in that sarah would have to ask herself if she would feel the same way if the situation were reversed? I doubt it. If she were in business she would be greatly dissapointed if a customer didn't make a reasonable effort to pay a debt that had earlier been agreed upon. Probably to the extent that a remedy in the courts would be sought....

Lastly, sarah expected to pay the bill and had indicated by her action in agreeing to the purchase that the value of the suite was equal to the amount she expected to pay... an important consideration under U.S. law. This further indicates an expectation of quid pro quo on the part of the seller... and buyer...

[Buenchico]

Thanks, Clanad, for your points. My post was based upon two main considerations. The first one is a personal opinion that inefficient companies should go out of business. A succesful High Street is not one where all the firms are making money. If the economy is working well, 10% to 15% of the shops on any High Street should go bust every year, to then be replaced by other firms who may, possibly, be more successful. It seems to me that any company which can't run its invoicing system properly should go out of business as quickly as possible.

The second point was based upon the laws of England & Wales. I never tried to suggest that Sarah has not entered into a contract. She has definitely done so. Furthermore, I never suggested that Sarah should not pay up and soon as she is asked to do so. I only pointed out that it's not her job to sort out the company's invoicing problems. Under our laws (and, I'm sure under yours as well) a company cannot initiate court action before they've even made a demand for payment! In England & Wales, if a company takes no action to recover a debt (i.e. if there's no contact at all, regarding the matter) for a period of 6 years then the debt continues to exist but becomes unrecoverable.

A final analogy: I do quite a bit of freelance writing. Obviously, once a newspaper has accepted an article from me, there is a contractual obligation upon them to pay me for my work at the rate which has been agreed. However, even if I managed to get a scoop for one of the national dailies, showing how World War 3 had narrowly been averted, which filled the front 10 pages of the paper, I can guarantee that if I forgot to submit an invoice then I wouldn't get paid a penny. The rule with newpapers is 'no invoice means no payment'. I don't see why it should be any different in any other business.

Chris

[smudge]

This company will catch up with you sarah, so have the money at the ready!

The company you ordered the dining room suite from, would have created an Order No. When the suite was delivered to the store, they would have created an Invoice No. & Account No. chargeable to you. The fact that you weren't given an Invoice at the time of delivery is irrelevant.

When the Sales Ledger Clerk does her monthly analysis, she/he will see that it has not been paid. They will then issue you with a Statement requesting the money. Once you have sent this, the remittance will be allocated to your outstanding account & matched. That will be the end of it.

Having said all that, I would still wait until they request payment from you. You can simply say you were waiting for them to issue an Invoice - enjoy the interest in the bank!

[Carol Anne]

What dilema?

Just pay up, sleep easy and enjoy your new furniture.

[curiosity]

I agree with Chris! I would keep the money aside though, My mother inlaw had a shower fitted by the Gas board about 10 years ago now, and has never had the bill! It's their fault. My other half nearly didn't graduate cos the university were claiming he hadn't paid one month of tuition fees. He had the bank statements and the evidence, which the accounts people asked for, he refused, based on Chris's principal, they should know he had paid and find their own evidence. If not then something needs changing, they'll never learn and develop if we help them out too much.

[kittyboo]

Dont pay !!! It's the Company's problem for being incompetent

[andrea_h]

my parents have recently had thesame kind of dilema with a carpet company!

a carpet was ordered and fitted last novemeber, but there was a problem & the carpet was unsatisfactory - payment was made, but after a **** up on their behalf payment was cancelled (coz the carpet company were messing around not answering calls etc and the carpet was still faulty) - after about 6 months they sent a letter wanting payment, we explained the reasons why they were still waiting - they ten apologised, fixed the problem and payment was made again. However, a few weeks later they recieved a letter of apology from the company, informing them that payment had already been made and that the payment had been refunded - this was last June!!

Last week my parents recieved another letter (a year later!) requesting payment (again!!!) even though they have kept all the letters & reciepts, they now don'tknow what to do.

I agree with those who say wait until they ask for payment - if they can't run their company it's there problem

[jenny21]

no i just wouldn`t tell them! if it was the other way round i am sure you would get bumped! i dont think they will know but if they do, just say you didnt realise! xx