Why Did We Shoot Spies?

[bainbrig]

Why did we execute spies? What harm could they do once we’d locked them up? Why didn’t we treat them like other POWs?

Was it just habit?

[Muntin]

On the 'gentlemen don't do spying' part of this thread:
The BBC recently did a series in which it was stated that the RAF would not transport our SAS men to N. Africa during WW 11, on the grounds that operating in a clandestine manner was not quite the done thing. And I do know that they were not spies, they were in uniform.

[naomi24]

I find that very difficult to believe, muntin.

[Muntin]

That's how I remember the programme went. May have been about the Long Range Desert Group, SAS precursor. I think the RAF changed their mind at some point, LRDG didn't get to N. Africa in kayaks.

[retrocop]

The only objection I recall about the RAF transporting the new fledgling SAS unit was the fact that their debut operation was hampered by severe weather conditions. A Ghibli I believe.
The RAF were reluctant to fly aged Bristol Bombays in such bad conditions and stated that the SAS were subjecting themelves in severe jeopardy if attempting a parachute drop.
Major Stirling insisted the OP went ahead as he was trying to sell his baby to the WD.
Sadly the RAF proved correct on this OP. That is why thereafter the SAS decided to liaise with the LRDG who would supply the transport to get the raiders to their intended targets.
Later on the SAS were given their own transport and became less reliant on the Brigands with Beards to take them into the blue.
No they didn't use kayaks. They all entered North Africa in troopships as members of Regular Army units of the day and volunteered to join the new units formulated by the likes of Bagnall and Stirling.
Bagnall mapped out North Africa and invented the Sun compass before the war. Magnetic compasses that the DAK relied on were unreliable due to strong magnetic forces in the Desert.
That is how the Allies were able to navigate more successfully than the Axis.

[bainbrig]

There’s two threads running in parallel here, the retrocop thread and the naomi thread.

The naomi thread’s line seems to be that we kill spies because a) we can, b) the ‘law’ is on our side, c) they might manage to smuggle secrets out of their prison cells, d) they are really bad people and don’t deserve our humanity, and e) (unspoken but I’m sure implied) that they are FOREIGN.

The retro/mushroom/jim line is less dogmatic, as you’d expect from the thinking side of these columns.

I’m not sure there is an ‘answer’. Except, I suspect, vindictiveness - my view being that most spies were just foot-soldiers, as guilty or innocent as any other. And often, even braver!

[naomi24]

bainbrig, //The naomi thread’s line seems to be that we kill spies because a) we can, b) the ‘law’ is on our side, c) they might manage to smuggle secrets out of their prison cells, d) they are really bad people and don’t deserve our humanity, and e) (unspoken but I’m sure implied) that they are FOREIGN. //

I haven't said any of that.

//The retro/mushroom/jim line is less dogmatic, as you’d expect from the thinking side of these columns. //

Do you have a thinking side? If you do, I suggest you use it. You're becoming increasingly confused.

[Jackdaw33]

Since time immemorial spies have been executed in wartime. Nothing new. Deterrence, self-preservation and the fact that dead men tell no tales is the rationale.

[bainbrig]

Thanks Jack, I sort of gathered that.

I still don’t see why we don’t just lock them away, like other ‘dangerous’ miscreants. Killing people in cold blood must be for stronger reasons than ‘because we do’.

[SparklyKid]

Because they deserved it, end off.

[bainbrig]

A foolish answer, sparkly.

[naomi24]

bainbrig, //Killing people in cold blood must be for stronger reasons than ‘because we do’. //

You've been given other reasons .... but clearly not those you want to hear.

[SparklyKid]

A stupid question Bainbrig, touche.

[Kromovaracun]

I don't believe in executing them. But you're asking what the rationale is when it happens, and I think it's probably to ensure that no more information can get leaked.

[dance2trance]

It is to learn them a lessons they don't do it again- so now!