Will It Be Compulsory?

[Barsel]

If we get the new vaccine, will it be compulsory to have it? I've heard a lot of people say they don't want it and some are unsure. If we don't all have it, will this mean it will stay around for even longer?

[Iamcazzy]

After all, you could have a healthy, office worker in their 30's married to a carer of the same age, both with gym membership or similar. One could go to the venue yet the other wouldn't be allowed if the venue required a certificate. No wonder Boris doesn't like the idea.

[woofgang]

the other more practical issue is that unless you are going to go to the same kind of trouble that is gone to to make passports, then any certificate is going to be easy enough to forge, especially in the days of photoprinters. Even if the originals are kept securely, once the first ones are out there forgeries will follow behind.
The old kind are even on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/333018234035?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=710-134428-41853-0&mkcid=2&itemid=333018234035&targetid=877696481749&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9050382&poi=&;campaignid=9441192132&mkgroupid=102652505024&rlsatarget=pla-877696481749&abcId=578896&merchantid=6995734&gclid=Cj0KCQiAtqL-BRC0ARIsAF4K3WE8K89WCnHoRPexa1mMA0h7Bf_fQsZzbiW7TajJv9CbxQzKzb3oEJsaAiiMEALw_wcB

[ichkeria]

"Yes but not after vaccination, assuming you are in the 90%. "

Yes, after vaccination, because it's a lot easier to stop the recipient of the vaccination from becoming ill, that it is to stop the thing replicating. Don't forget that the a vaccine won't stop you "catching" the virus: it just stops you becoming ill. What the virus does next is unpredictable. So that is why it is important that as many people as possible have it. It's the reverse of the claim made about the efficacy of face masks, namely that they only protect others, not the wearer.

[jno]

Barsel, many people are worried about the long-term effects of Covid too. We know there's a "long Covid" that may hang about for weeks or months - we don't know more than that because it's been here less than a year. Not everyone gets better after a couple of weeks.

[ToraToraTora]

woofgang: "then any certificate is going to be easy enough to forge, especially in the days of photoprinters." - it'll be a verifiable scan able QR bar code containing uniquely attributable information.

[ToraToraTora]

ich: "Don't forget that the a vaccine won't stop you "catching" the virus: it just stops you becoming ill. " - err no! it's trains the body to kill the virus, it cannot exist in the body once the defences are thus trained that's how vaccines work.

[bobbinwales]

//Not everyone gets better after a couple of weeks.//
Yes 60000 sadly arent here in UK anymore to tell us that

[ToraToraTora]

ich, yes a person with the vaccine will initially contract the virus but the body's immune system will be there ready and kill it.

[bobbinwales]

am not sure thats right TTT. Sounds sensible but even the scientists there not sure and some say you might still be able to pass it on. Hope there wrong

[Old_Geezer]

Boris seems to realise that it's not our culture to make it compulsory, at least that's what he says. Pity he didn't realise earlier when he was dictating what must be put on citizen's faces. Still, perhaps he's learning.

[ichkeria]

|t's not been proved yet that the vaccines we have will do that.
The Pfizer people have been at pains to point out that their vaccine is not proven to stop transmission.
The Oxford people on the other hand I believe are more optimistic about theirs.
What I am really saying is that in principle, a vaccination certificate is not a passport to safety to others and it would be dangerous to assume that it is.
And it seems the PM agrees.

[ToraToraTora]

I've just been looking at the science and they describe the way it works as I have intimated above.

[Barsel]

TTT ///the body's immune system will be there ready and kill it.///

Some people, myself included, had to shield because of a low immune system so how would they work then?

[ichkeria]

One article of many ...

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2020-11-19/vaccines-from-pfizer-moderna-fight-covid-19-but-may-not-stop-spread

[ToraToraTora]

barsel, the vaccine trains the immune system, if it's weak I suspect there will a slower response to the presence of the virus.

[THECORBYLOON]

The effect on transmission is yet to be determined.

"Questioned by Jeremy Hunt, the former health secretary, who now chairs the health committee, Hancock said it was possible that some social distancing measures could remain as vaccines are rolled out, until it could be determined how effective the vaccines were at preventing not just symptoms but also transmission."

[Peter Pedant]

not bad here
https://www.newscientist.com/article/2261805-everything-you-need-to-know-about-the-pfizer-biontech-covid-19-vaccine/

as for people with weak immune systems they need it more and not less. It is almost impossible to survive with NO immune system ( speaking as someone who had a lymph count of 30 instead of 2000. ) or [0.03 instead of 2]. clearly higher now but I was warned I would probably be immunosuppressed for the rest of my miserable existence and I have to say I am looking forward to it

[Peter Pedant]

// We know there's a "long Covid" that may hang about for weeks or months//
but we also know by following them that 90% are negative after three months. - whilst they continue to be shogged

[jno]

PP, yeah, they're fit to travel but not fit to get out of bed.