How Much Longer Will The World Continue To Finance Ukraine?

[youngmafbog]

OK, I’m probably going to get a lot of flak for this, but I feel it is a question that needs considering (And no I don’t have an answer).

Like it or not there is growing resentment that so much money is being spent on arms and military equipment for Ukraine whilst we all struggle under mountains of debt.  Add to that the ‘Offensives’ never seem to really materialise and both side seem stuck in a stalemate whilst the body count on both sides mounts up.

So, is it time for some sort of negotiation or should it be allowed to just plow on?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12583467/Zelenskys-Western-support-dented-Slovakia-election-American-congress.html

[Peter Pedant]

yeah it astounds me that countries with a border with Russia publicly wonder if the threat really is THAT bad

well they will be the first to find out!

[Khandro]

'New polling provides further evidence that American public support for Ukraine remains robust and bipartisan, and may even be more forward-leaning than the opinions of many in Congress or the White House.'

Atlantic Council.   Today

 

So it might not be the vote-winner Trump thinks it is ?

[Zacs-Master]

The US will always side with anything anti Russian. 

[William51]

 Do we give Putin what he wants?. He is not stupid, he consolidated his forces in the South and is banking on keeping it in a negotiated settlement.

[ichkeria]

I think Putin is quite stupid actually: and getting stupider.

By which I mean that his tactics may make sense within his own sphere but as Russia becomes more isolated that are increasingly out of touch with the rest of the world.

How else to explain his bonkers speech in Sochi yesterday or indeed atrocities like Hroza: it seems Russian thinking is that enough of this and Ukrainians will turn against their government.

As I said above, it's the Ukrainian civilian population who pay the price for this stupidity 

[Khandro]

Yes, I agree about Putin.

Hroza is about the size of my village (pop. 350) and we do have a café /restaurant - it's by the beautiful river - and the thought of what happened there is so tragic and unimaginable for the villagers.

There are reports that there was a funeral taking place for a soldier from the village & a spy had tipped off the Russians that there would be lots of military present, which there wasn't.

Who knows if this is true? but it was on Medusa & they are usually reliable.

 

 

[ichkeria]

Yes khandro: it was a wake in a cafe for the reburial of a soldier who had been killed a while back.

His wife and other relatives were among the dead. People insist on returning to their native villages despite the obvious dangers, and that area of Kharkiv is particularly perilous, especially because as we know the Russians deliberately target civilians: this wasn't an accident.

[ichkeria]

This business of the spy tip-off also occurred after a previous atrocity in a cafe in a Donetsk town whose name escapes me. It shows the absolute disregard for non-military human life that exists and I very much doubt they were bothered who they nit.

Brace yourself for the forthcoming documentary https://20daysinmariupol.com/ by Mstyslav Chernov. I think it will be available on PBS in November.

[douglas9401]

Has anybody included range finders and gunsights in the arms supplies?

 

They seem to have burned through a helluva lot of stuff over the piece.

Also, is it free or on the same basis as we got all that stuff in WWII and paid back over time?

[tomus42]

//Also, is it free or on the same basis as we got all that stuff in WWII and paid back over time?//

Good question. I'm pretty sure we were paying America back for ww2 loans until fairly recently.

The answer is we should finance them for as long as it takes. 

[Khandro]

tomus //Good question. I'm pretty sure we were paying America back for ww2 loans until fairly recently.//

 

It was as recently as Gorden Brown who paid off the final payment.

[Rosetta]

Putin thinks the west is weak and  cant sustain policy/motivation over the longer term. He thinks he  has only got to keep on until the west's resolve starts to diminish and then he will get what he wants, and that may include further empire building attempts. This would be at our peril. Fortunately we seem to be standing firm at the moment, but I do worry about the US becoming more self isolating from its international obligations and becoming "little America". Its not without precedence, America were initially unwilling to get involved in the war against Hitler prior to Pearl Harbour 

[ichkeria]

In reply to the query above the lend lease program appears to have been abandoned.

[ichkeria]

@22.43: exactly so

[tomus42]

22.43 - Alot will depend on what happens in the American elections next year.

[Ellipsis]

> Like it or not there is growing resentment that so much money is being spent on arms and military equipment for Ukraine whilst we all struggle under mountains of debt. 

Come on, don't be coy. That's too lame to finish it yhere. Work it through to completion ... where do you see it finishing, if Ukraine is not helped with money? And is that place somewhere that you're happy for the UK and the west to be?