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what question would religionists like to ask atheists?
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It would appear that there are a lot of religious people on AB who answer questions from us atheists/agnostics so it is only fair to return the compliment and give us a chance to answer your questions (yes, I know that questions HAVE been asked but this is a direct challenge to beliveirs to air their questions to non believers).So, what is it that you would like to know about atheism and atheistic belief systems?
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'Surely it's not that unreasonable to ask "What do I have to show you to make you believe in God"?'
God himself is gonna have to pay me a visit before I believe he exists. Although he'll have to be pretty convincing, turning up on my doorstep saying 'Hi I'm God' just woouldn't cut it. Perhaps a brief flight through time or resurrecting a few dead people would do it, I'm sure He already knows the best way to convince me.
God himself is gonna have to pay me a visit before I believe he exists. Although he'll have to be pretty convincing, turning up on my doorstep saying 'Hi I'm God' just woouldn't cut it. Perhaps a brief flight through time or resurrecting a few dead people would do it, I'm sure He already knows the best way to convince me.
As it's Christmas, I'm being greedy and asking two questions.
1)It is reasonable to assume that people get upset when 'religion' is stuffed down their throats, but does it make you angry to see a Christian, like me, holding on to my belief in Jesus Christ, in the face of all of your arguments to the contrary?
2) How do atheists / agnostics explain the uncanny accuracy of Bible prophecy?
And a merry Christmas and a happy and peaceful new year to all of you.
1)It is reasonable to assume that people get upset when 'religion' is stuffed down their throats, but does it make you angry to see a Christian, like me, holding on to my belief in Jesus Christ, in the face of all of your arguments to the contrary?
2) How do atheists / agnostics explain the uncanny accuracy of Bible prophecy?
And a merry Christmas and a happy and peaceful new year to all of you.
Theland, please be as greedy as you like.No , it doesnt make me angry to see you hanging on to your beliefs but it does make me sad.For one, you have consistently refused to answer my questions and obviously buried your head in the sand of theistic belief.For another you believe in a book that by your own admission you have not read all the way through.One reason that I never quote Darwins books is that ive never read them all the way through so it would be hypocritical for me to quote them as though I know them.
As for the 'uncanny' prophicies of the bible...rubish.The prophicies most often quoted are nearly all taken out of context and mostly so open to interpratation as to be meaningless.
Happy Mithras to you Theland and a happy new solstice.(or something like that....im a bit full of xmas cheer at the moment ---tenants super to be exact---lol)
As for the 'uncanny' prophicies of the bible...rubish.The prophicies most often quoted are nearly all taken out of context and mostly so open to interpratation as to be meaningless.
Happy Mithras to you Theland and a happy new solstice.(or something like that....im a bit full of xmas cheer at the moment ---tenants super to be exact---lol)
Theland, No it doesn't make me angry to see someone of faith holding onto it... but it can be frustrating, especially when one feels that the weight of science, history, evidence and logic favour the view that the faith is misplaced!
Paradoxically, I do get irritated when I see an answer to someone elses question which just states, in effect, that "God dunnit"... I have no problem with someone giving answers... I just wish they would be prefaced with a disclaimer, along the lines of "its my belief", or "my reading of the bible would suggest"... rather than give an absolute answer... I try to offer a disclaimer to all my own answers, but I will admit that this doesn't always happen.
Biblical prophecy... It is your understanding, and those of a like minded view Theland, that biblical prophecy is "uncannily accurate". Those of us who require evidence would argue that this statement is absolutely incorrect.
Paradoxically, I do get irritated when I see an answer to someone elses question which just states, in effect, that "God dunnit"... I have no problem with someone giving answers... I just wish they would be prefaced with a disclaimer, along the lines of "its my belief", or "my reading of the bible would suggest"... rather than give an absolute answer... I try to offer a disclaimer to all my own answers, but I will admit that this doesn't always happen.
Biblical prophecy... It is your understanding, and those of a like minded view Theland, that biblical prophecy is "uncannily accurate". Those of us who require evidence would argue that this statement is absolutely incorrect.
I should add to my answer here... actually, it does make me angry when I see faith based answers challenging, ignoring or being dismissive of scientifically and evidentially proven theories.
For example,the recent attempt by an organisation called "Truth In Science", to get Young Earth Creationism onto the Science agenda in UK secondary schools, by sending unsolicited DVDs to all secondary schools in the UK containing propaganda under the guise of "Intelligent Design", and trying to equate the "Theory" of ID as being on a par with evolution, which is lightly dismissed as "only a theory" ...That sort of thing makes me mad.
Or hearing excerpts of a biology lesson in a faith school in NI, where the kids are being taught Creationism in place of Evolution...... that makes me very angry.
For example,the recent attempt by an organisation called "Truth In Science", to get Young Earth Creationism onto the Science agenda in UK secondary schools, by sending unsolicited DVDs to all secondary schools in the UK containing propaganda under the guise of "Intelligent Design", and trying to equate the "Theory" of ID as being on a par with evolution, which is lightly dismissed as "only a theory" ...That sort of thing makes me mad.
Or hearing excerpts of a biology lesson in a faith school in NI, where the kids are being taught Creationism in place of Evolution...... that makes me very angry.
I don't get angry about Christians personal belief but I do when I see it in public policy. For example in state funded religious schools and mandatory acts of worship in school.
Prophesy is a remarkable thing - the followers of Nostradamus claim incredible predictions as do astrologers, psychics and all manner of witch-doctors.
But lets look at a few biblical predictions that failed:
(Ezek 30:10 NRSV) Thus says the Lord GOD: I will put an end to the hordes of Egypt, by the hand of King Nebuchadrezzar of Babylon.
Whoopsie!
Isaiah 17:1 The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.
Isaiah 52:1 Awake, awake; put on thy strength, O Zion; put on thy beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city: for henceforth there shall no more come into thee the uncircumcised and the unclean.
There are uncircumcised people living in Jerusalem even today.
You see If you don't "time box" a prophesy people just say "oh it hasn't come to pass yet"
I could prophesise the distruction of London but if I just leave it open ended and vague like all your OT prophets it's a bit meaningless
Prophesy is a remarkable thing - the followers of Nostradamus claim incredible predictions as do astrologers, psychics and all manner of witch-doctors.
But lets look at a few biblical predictions that failed:
(Ezek 30:10 NRSV) Thus says the Lord GOD: I will put an end to the hordes of Egypt, by the hand of King Nebuchadrezzar of Babylon.
Whoopsie!
Isaiah 17:1 The burden of Damascus. Behold, Damascus is taken away from being a city, and it shall be a ruinous heap.
Isaiah 52:1 Awake, awake; put on thy strength, O Zion; put on thy beautiful garments, O Jerusalem, the holy city: for henceforth there shall no more come into thee the uncircumcised and the unclean.
There are uncircumcised people living in Jerusalem even today.
You see If you don't "time box" a prophesy people just say "oh it hasn't come to pass yet"
I could prophesise the distruction of London but if I just leave it open ended and vague like all your OT prophets it's a bit meaningless
Theland, here are a few failed biblical prophecies for you to peruse over:-
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/proph/lo ng.html
http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/proph/lo ng.html
Fingerprint, In answer to your question, "have you ever looked for God?", I'm still looking in spite of the fact that the deeper and further I look the less I like what I see. "So why do I persist?", you ask.
The beauty of truth rests in the indisputability of its completeness. As long as there is another rational mind out there engaged in a rigorous pursuit of the truth I will find joy in my efforts to fill in the pieces that I have received from others or found myself along the way. Humanity has revealed a wealth of knowledge of itself and the world in which it dwells, far more than any one person could discover or even assimilate for oneself. Nevertheless when we are able to relate some portion of knowledge and share the benefits of our individual experiences with each other it is a win win proposition.
The world has suffered far to long from the consequences of an open ended and indefinable �concept� of what a �God� is and what that �God� would have us do. It is time for some clarity and to my knowledge that quality does not exists within the gamut of the world�s religions. The spectrum of religious ideologies are only one face of the many facetted realm of mysticism, but within its domain can be found many of the enemies of reason and unlawful rules of logic, such as faith, that infect all the others.
The beauty of truth rests in the indisputability of its completeness. As long as there is another rational mind out there engaged in a rigorous pursuit of the truth I will find joy in my efforts to fill in the pieces that I have received from others or found myself along the way. Humanity has revealed a wealth of knowledge of itself and the world in which it dwells, far more than any one person could discover or even assimilate for oneself. Nevertheless when we are able to relate some portion of knowledge and share the benefits of our individual experiences with each other it is a win win proposition.
The world has suffered far to long from the consequences of an open ended and indefinable �concept� of what a �God� is and what that �God� would have us do. It is time for some clarity and to my knowledge that quality does not exists within the gamut of the world�s religions. The spectrum of religious ideologies are only one face of the many facetted realm of mysticism, but within its domain can be found many of the enemies of reason and unlawful rules of logic, such as faith, that infect all the others.
Philosophy is reasons battleground for the discovery and organisation of what knowledge is, how we obtain it and how it should be used. Religion does not seek to impart wisdom but demands blind obedience with the threat of eternal punishment for noncompliance. Such �wisdom�, even when derived from truth is of little use and usually destructive. Just as a gun can serve good or evil depending upon whether or not its use is accompanied by a proper moral guidance, wisdom divorced from understanding is the tool of those who haven�t the time or inclination to have their authority challenged.
I appreciate your search for the truth but insist on your own understanding of what is presented to you in its name. Without understanding, my version of the truth, or anyone else�s, is in affect a lost cause.
I appreciate your search for the truth but insist on your own understanding of what is presented to you in its name. Without understanding, my version of the truth, or anyone else�s, is in affect a lost cause.
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