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Society & Culture0 min ago
Golden age?
19 Answers
Following on from Theland's "Everything's breaking down" thread, which age would anyone like to return to?
No cheating now, values are a "job lot" if you want the thirties you get 30's attitudes to women, homosexuality etc.
50's and you still get half day closing, bank managers in bowler hats and knowing your place at work!
So bearing that in mind which "golden age" would you like to return to?
No cheating now, values are a "job lot" if you want the thirties you get 30's attitudes to women, homosexuality etc.
50's and you still get half day closing, bank managers in bowler hats and knowing your place at work!
So bearing that in mind which "golden age" would you like to return to?
Answers
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Well I didn�t bother to reply to that thread as much of it seemed to evolve into irrelevant nonsense.
For about 10,000 years Britain has been a corrupted, violent and feudal society and although things may seem bad now we are at a golden age since we live in (relative)peacetime. People are far too quick to assume that things are horrendous now without any understanding or background in our own history. Religion plays a part in the history of our society � of course it must � but in this we must also consider the child murdering (sorry�. sacrificing) tree hugging, sun/moon-worshipping pagans, you know, the ones that really did sacrifice virgins, illiterate or disabled children to appease their own gods. Society has always been suspicious of its neighbours (feudal), and would use any means necessary, including good/bad omens and religious beliefs and superstitions to coerce people into uncharacteristic violence. Yes medieval Jeudo-Christianity was malevolent, following the traditional violent enforcement of all forms - Celtic worship, pagan worship, roman rule and then following its own - Nazist persecution of Jews. All acts of violent enforcement whether religious or otherwise are abhorrent, and whilst we can ridicule or blame religion for past crimes against humanity, can we really blame the current culture of violent crime and gun crime and social degradation on religion, or the cyclical process of human nature?
There is no �golden age� for me, but if I must choose, then I suppose it would be my childhood years when cares and worries were generally insignificant and the world went by with blue skies, fluffy clouds and holidays to the seaside. 1970�s! Although, I doubt I would like to return to those times. I wouldn�t mind popping up in Dickensian Britain, so long as I was an aristocrat though, not a pauper!
For about 10,000 years Britain has been a corrupted, violent and feudal society and although things may seem bad now we are at a golden age since we live in (relative)peacetime. People are far too quick to assume that things are horrendous now without any understanding or background in our own history. Religion plays a part in the history of our society � of course it must � but in this we must also consider the child murdering (sorry�. sacrificing) tree hugging, sun/moon-worshipping pagans, you know, the ones that really did sacrifice virgins, illiterate or disabled children to appease their own gods. Society has always been suspicious of its neighbours (feudal), and would use any means necessary, including good/bad omens and religious beliefs and superstitions to coerce people into uncharacteristic violence. Yes medieval Jeudo-Christianity was malevolent, following the traditional violent enforcement of all forms - Celtic worship, pagan worship, roman rule and then following its own - Nazist persecution of Jews. All acts of violent enforcement whether religious or otherwise are abhorrent, and whilst we can ridicule or blame religion for past crimes against humanity, can we really blame the current culture of violent crime and gun crime and social degradation on religion, or the cyclical process of human nature?
There is no �golden age� for me, but if I must choose, then I suppose it would be my childhood years when cares and worries were generally insignificant and the world went by with blue skies, fluffy clouds and holidays to the seaside. 1970�s! Although, I doubt I would like to return to those times. I wouldn�t mind popping up in Dickensian Britain, so long as I was an aristocrat though, not a pauper!
I'd say the 60's. People still had respect for each other and cared about their neighbours, children (in the main) respected authority and received a good basic education, you could walk down the street late at night in safety, television wasn't filled with tacky chat shows advising people on their "relationships", or with reality shows that make stars out of talentless nobodies, and you could go into hospital and get the best treatment without worrying about catching a flesh-eating infection whilst you were there. Oh .... and the music was the best ever!
The 60's were full of people raging about how all these long haired weirdo's were bringing civilisation to it's knees!
1964 - Mods and Rockers rioting on Brighton seafront
1968 Mary Bell was found guilty of murdering 2 children - she went to see one of the mothers 2 days after to tell her "I know he's dead"
You might have been slightly less likely to be mugged - providing you weren't gay - ask Quentin Crisp and you'd be far more likely to die in a road accident anyway.
Foreign holidays were for the rich and even then you were limited by how much foreign money you could take out .
There were restrictions on mortgages - you had to save with a building society for years to be allowed one and you'd be pretty lucky to be able to afford a car in 1960.
Just to ice the cake life expectancy is up 6 years since 1960
I think you can keep the 60's
1964 - Mods and Rockers rioting on Brighton seafront
1968 Mary Bell was found guilty of murdering 2 children - she went to see one of the mothers 2 days after to tell her "I know he's dead"
You might have been slightly less likely to be mugged - providing you weren't gay - ask Quentin Crisp and you'd be far more likely to die in a road accident anyway.
Foreign holidays were for the rich and even then you were limited by how much foreign money you could take out .
There were restrictions on mortgages - you had to save with a building society for years to be allowed one and you'd be pretty lucky to be able to afford a car in 1960.
Just to ice the cake life expectancy is up 6 years since 1960
I think you can keep the 60's
But you could pick holes in any decade or era! I too could mention loads of bad things about the 60's for one i hate the fact that young mums were more or less forced to give their babies away if un-married and that is just the one that springs to mind but i think we're talking on a whole really, not picking up on individual events.
All had good and bad in them.
So which is your "golden era" then jake the peg?
All had good and bad in them.
So which is your "golden era" then jake the peg?
Each age has its own plusses and minusses as so eloquently se out in the posts above, so it's a trade off, I think, to swap the idea of society now, with society in days gone by. There is no perfect age, but how do we measure the quality of life, now and then?
Without a doubt, the very building block of society, the family, is breaking down, so I would yearn for a time when that was not so, and a time when there was a greater sense of community, and less emphasis on materialism.
Without a doubt, the very building block of society, the family, is breaking down, so I would yearn for a time when that was not so, and a time when there was a greater sense of community, and less emphasis on materialism.
Octavius - I came from the East End and contrary to popular belief, ordinary people didn't live in fear of the Krays and the Richardsons. They were gangsters and had much bigger fish to fry. Although that area wasn't problem free, there was nothing like the trouble our cities experience today. Binge drinking and the problems it creates wasn't the norm, and if a fight broke out, it was with fists - not with knives and guns. People didn't get mugged; no one bashed little old ladies over the head to steal their pensions, and strange as it may seem, you really could walk through the East End safely late at night in the 60s. My friends and I did it regularly after missing the last bus home from the West End - mini skirts and all! You might have had the odd car full of fellows drive by with "allo darling, wanna lift?", but that was about it. Honestly. Given a choice I much rather the country and the people we had then than what we have now.
I don't think there ever was a golden age.
I think that when some people get to a certain age they start bemoaning the standards of the day.
Theland does it now but he follows a line going back to the ancient Romans.
Society isn't breaking down into some hell-hole of debauchery but it is changing, it has always changed and that's probably a good thing. Otherwise we'd still be tugging our forelocks to the squire or bank manager (remember them!)
These claims are rarely backed up by data, they are often just the impressions and prejudices of those voicing them.
I'm always amazed by the number of people who seem to think that their own experiences must be representitive of the whole country!
For example Theland says that the family is breaking down - yet the divorce rate in England and Wales has actually been pretty stable since the early 80's and has actually fallen a bit recently
http://www.999-life.com/marriage-counseling-co unselor/divorce-rate-england-wales.pdf
I think that when some people get to a certain age they start bemoaning the standards of the day.
Theland does it now but he follows a line going back to the ancient Romans.
Society isn't breaking down into some hell-hole of debauchery but it is changing, it has always changed and that's probably a good thing. Otherwise we'd still be tugging our forelocks to the squire or bank manager (remember them!)
These claims are rarely backed up by data, they are often just the impressions and prejudices of those voicing them.
I'm always amazed by the number of people who seem to think that their own experiences must be representitive of the whole country!
For example Theland says that the family is breaking down - yet the divorce rate in England and Wales has actually been pretty stable since the early 80's and has actually fallen a bit recently
http://www.999-life.com/marriage-counseling-co unselor/divorce-rate-england-wales.pdf
Naomi, I won�t dispute your own personal experiences, but my parents lived in the East End from the 1950�s (my mother still lives there) and I can without any shadow of doubt state that common people were afraid of the underworld gangs and the power and influence they had � even over the local businesses, shops and pubs. And knives were a common form of fighting weapon as were guns.
Granted it might not have appeared to be so random and prevalent as we see it today as there may have been an ethos of �honour amongst thieves� but fear on the street was common and very real. I grew up in the East End of the 1970�s and we were petrified of gangs of skinheads that used to roam the streets in their bovva boots.
JTP, as I said above, if any age is to be a golden age then surely it must be one where society can exist without fear of war, famine and pestilence. Fortunately for us, that time would be about now 1950 - 2000 odd (I said �relative peace� above as we still live in times where wars/acts of atrocities are occurring around us). The breakdown of society can lead to these things, hence we may even be on the brink of leaving our latest golden age behind and entering a new era�.
Granted it might not have appeared to be so random and prevalent as we see it today as there may have been an ethos of �honour amongst thieves� but fear on the street was common and very real. I grew up in the East End of the 1970�s and we were petrified of gangs of skinheads that used to roam the streets in their bovva boots.
JTP, as I said above, if any age is to be a golden age then surely it must be one where society can exist without fear of war, famine and pestilence. Fortunately for us, that time would be about now 1950 - 2000 odd (I said �relative peace� above as we still live in times where wars/acts of atrocities are occurring around us). The breakdown of society can lead to these things, hence we may even be on the brink of leaving our latest golden age behind and entering a new era�.
Jake - We can all only speak from our own life experiences. By your own admissison society has always changed, so it stands to reason that the longer you're around, the more changes you experience.
Perhaps the reason the divorce rate is low is that for the past 20 years or so a lot of couples haven't bothered to get married. I don't suppose there are any figures on the number of unmarried couples that separate, but when they split up, it still means the breakdown of the family.
Quite a high percentage of children come from single parent homes now, and I wouldn't mind betting that if the figures for all the splits (married or not) were added together, the statistics for the rate of family breakdown would soar, so I'm with Theland on this one.
Perhaps the reason the divorce rate is low is that for the past 20 years or so a lot of couples haven't bothered to get married. I don't suppose there are any figures on the number of unmarried couples that separate, but when they split up, it still means the breakdown of the family.
Quite a high percentage of children come from single parent homes now, and I wouldn't mind betting that if the figures for all the splits (married or not) were added together, the statistics for the rate of family breakdown would soar, so I'm with Theland on this one.
Cave people, no organised religion, no organised crime, no marriages, no concept of the family unit only tribe or pack/gang culture, no synthetic drugs, no alcohol, only primitive weaponry mainly for hunting and foraging, no TV, no media, no internet, no medical knowledge, minimal life expectancy, and minimal amounts of clothing (not such a bad thing if the cave women are fit)? Sounds like we went down hill from there then!
. . . perhaps if we knew now what they knew then it would not paint such a lovely picture
Perhaps our greatest concern should be that the benefits we derive from advancements in technology are not made available to those who do not share the desire and vision to see to it that they are used wisely for the advancement of humanity.
hindsight is 20/20
Useful knowledge is gained at the expense of the pain we endure in the process of learning. We must not seek the anesthesia of forgetfulness so easily.
History is an endless sequence of pronouncements of doom. What really matters as we write the future of history is that we get it right sometimes.
Perhaps our greatest concern should be that the benefits we derive from advancements in technology are not made available to those who do not share the desire and vision to see to it that they are used wisely for the advancement of humanity.
hindsight is 20/20
Useful knowledge is gained at the expense of the pain we endure in the process of learning. We must not seek the anesthesia of forgetfulness so easily.
History is an endless sequence of pronouncements of doom. What really matters as we write the future of history is that we get it right sometimes.
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