Ali G

[Brugel]

I've never watched the Ali G show- I've just seen parts of it here and there- so perhaps this explains my confusion over the show. But what I'd like to know is why he is so popular when the Black and White Minstrel Show was deemed to be offensive and removed from television. Shouldn't they both be equally offensive or equally non-offensive? What is it that I'm missing here?

[LeMarchand]

AFAIK Ali G isn't a white person pretending to be black, but a white person playing a person who is white, but wants to be black. The joke is on the sort of wannabe gangstas that seem to proliferate in parts of suburbia, whereas the B&WMS had a load of white folks as bad caricatures of black people.

[el duerino]

irony

[Pishdecoof]

Brugel, I take it you are over 55? If so, then you probably haven't grown up surrounded by horrible little hooded white boys pretending to be black gangsta rappers - it is this type of person that Ali G is aping. The Black and White Minstrel Show was offensive because it portrayed black men as jet black singing and dancing imbeciles with glow in the dark teeth and eyes.

[Brugel]

Er, no I'm not over 55. I'm at that age where I'm too young to have seen "The Black and White Minstrel Show" and too old to watch "Ali G". My question was a genuine one- I was under the impression that both programmes featured white people pretending to be black and so I wondered why one was regarded as offensive and the other wasn't. Under the circumstances, I think the question was reasonable. LeMarchand seems to have answered my question. But what el duerino and Pishdecoof have said raises another: if Ali G is acceptable because he apes "horrible little hooded white boys" then why wasn't the programme "Love Thy Neighbour" acceptable given that it seemed to make fun of white racists? And there's also the fact that many of the people who like Ali G seem to be the same people the show is supposed to make fun of. I'm not accusing anyone of hypocrisy here- I'm just genuinely interested. (Incidentally Pishdecoof, since you mentioned age, what age are you?)

[EliPledge]

I've always thought Ali G was a stereotype of specifically Asian youth who have appropriated hip-hop culture, not white youth - doesn't he refer to his Uncle Abdul or something who owns a clothing warehouse? I'm not saying this makes it any more or less acceptable - just making a point.

[littleoldme]

I'm not (quite) old enough to remember Love Thy Neighbour although I did see the spin-off film when it was somewhat improbably repeated a few years ago. I did wonder what the difference was between that and, say, Till Death Do Us Part, where Alf Garnett frequently referred to black people using a 'c' word that rhymes with spoon. I can only assume that it's to do with where the audience's sympathies lie. Alf Garnett is meant to be a pompous, objectionable character with whom the audience is not meant to identify or sympathise, although Warren Mitchell's performance does often slip into pathos. Was Jack Smethurst's character in LTN in some way meant to be more 'cuddly', someone with whom a predominately white audience could have sympathy or, worse still, empathy? Again, a genuine question. Sorry if I'm missing the obvious, but I'd love someone to explain it to me!

[littleoldme]

BTW, I should point out that my viewing of the Love Thy Neighbour film was purely out of morbid curiosity :O) For the record, there are more laughs in the average episode of Eastenders.

[EliPledge]

Well, at the risk of reigniting a debate which raged a couple of years ago on the old TV Cream board, I think the Till Death Us...acceptable - Love Thy...unacceptable contast boils down to pure comedy snobbery i.e. BBC good, ITV bad.

[WoWo]

While I have always understood Warren Mitchels explanation of the Alf Garnett character, I think he totaly misses the point that its lost on 70% of the audience and they are tuning in to here all the racist bits other show's shy away from.

[WoWo]

On the subject of Ali G, I think the show has become something outside of its original intention. I think the character was developed for the purpose of getting people in positions of power to look stupid by getting them to appear on a 'Yoff' TV show with the presenter 'Ali G' who then made them look fools by showing they were totally outside of the real world.

[Mattk]

what a lot of people dont realise is that progs like love thy neighbour and in sickness and in health werent racist.both contained a character who was racist and in both cases was the stupid one.