Puppy Diet Advice for Food Intolerance

[Julz08]

My 12 week old cocker spaniel, Tokyo, has had diarrhorea ever since we picked him up from the breeder, we thought at first it was the change in environment. We were feeding him what the breeder had fed him (James Wellbeloved Turkey & Rice Kibble). He didn't seem unwell at any stage. On taking him to have his first injection I informed the vet who said it could be worms and wormed him. On taking him for his second injection he asked about his motions and I told him I hadn't seen any worms and his motions were formed in the morning but as the day went on they became looser, last thing at night being the worst. The vet said it was a possible food intolerance and to feed him on 2oz of cooked chicken or white fish distributed over his 3 meals with mashed potato and boiled rice. The 1st 2 days on this diet he seemed fine (haven't tried the fish yet) but today he went out for his morning pooh and it was nicely formed but on giving him his breakfast ,15 minutes later it was as if he passed the lot back through and I can only describe the consistency as unset mousse (sorry if that put any of you off mousse for life!!). Friends and relatives keep giving lots of advise like he shouldn't have mashed potato or it could be the chicken and we are getting a little confused. Ideally we would like the little fella to have a kibble diet but will continue on the home cooked until Monday (14.04.08) as the vet advised and if no better will go and see the vet again. Has anyone else had a puppy with a food intolerance and can you advise. At the moment I'm not even sure if we are giving him enough to eat as the vet didn't advise on quantity other than giving him the same amount as we were giving him the kibble but kibble and home cooked food is a different consistency and weight, he woofs down what we give him and looks for more but that can be cockers for you, We just want whats best for the little chap. Thanx in anticipation of anyones response. Julz08

[leelapops]

Oh Julz, poor pup! He sounds healthy otherwise though, so it does seem to be a food thing.
Our dog was eventually, after many months of upset tummies and accidents in the house, diagnosed as being gluten intolerant. This shouldn't be the case with yours, as I believe James Wellbeloved is wheat-gluten free.

If he has been treated for worms, that eliminates it really. Chicken is fine to give him, and I would say 'chicken and rice' is the best option. Rice is a little firmer, and might solidify his poo a bit. You might need to spend a week doing a food diary or something, and then eliminate each type of food/ingredient over the course of a few weeks to see if avoiding certain things makes him better.
Some dogs can be allergic to any kind of cereal, or to red meat...SO it can be hard to suss it out.

There are complete kibble foods available that are hyper sensitive, and don't contain the most common things that upset dogs' tummies.

Stay persistent with the vet; yours sounds quite co-operative, but mine was very patronising, and not too helpful.

I have no inhibitions when it comes to poo, after Jack's illness, but I won't be touching mousse again for some time! ;)

Hope your little fella is all better soon. A cuddle from me (at arms' length if he is still runny!) xx

[woofgang]

have you spoken to the breeder? If he was on JW with her /him with no problems then maybe its not that. Does anyone in the family give him treats? is there anything in the garden/house that he could be eating. personally I wouldn't give mashed potato as i know that some dogs can't tolerate it, but stick with boiled chicken and rice. As a rulish of thumb I give 3 times the weight of rice mixture as I would dry dog food as two parts of cooked rice is water. I also make sure that most of what is given is rice but your vet seems to have that sussed with the 2oz protein thing. Is he happy, lively, putting on weight shiny coat, not dehydrated etc?
We have just had long drawn out tum probs with our two pointer pups but we knew the cause....they eat horse poo if they get the chance (and I live in the New Forest) eventually it caused a bacterial tummy bug which meant antibi injections and tablets and kaolin on their food which has sorted it. You can get tuim settling preparations for dogs that have kaolin,pectin and probiotics in which might be worth asking your vet about. If he's well then let it go till monday but IMHO if he is at all losing weight, tired, skinny etcet then I would go back before monday.
Poor little chap, they arre a worry aren't they?

[leelapops]

Woofgang, good point!
x

[lankeela]

Puppies can dehydrate very quickly, make sure he is drinking plenty of water. I would definitely contact the breeder, I would want to know if it was one of mine. I know its too late now, but I am afraid I would have returned him to the breeder (even if it was only until his poos firmed up) as no puppy should be passed on in this condition. If the breeder is not helpful then you just need to follow the chicken and rice diet and keep in touch with your vet. Such a shame, when these first few weeks should be full of fun and learning.

[jules77]

I would just add that one of my dogs (who we lost a couple of years ago to old age) could not tolerate rice in any shape or form. He was a healthy puppy until he got to five months old when he started to be very fussy with his food. To cut a long story short, he had blood tests and the vet diagnosed malabsorption. It took us until he was eighteen months old to get any body on him, as he was just not absorbing the nutrients in his food. Strangely his first poo of the day was ok, but on a long walk, he would go more than once, and the more he went, the looser the poo got, so much so we had to keep a watering can in the car to clean him off before he got in. He had to go on a prescription diet for six months, after which time I found some pro biotic powder called Protect, which was new on the market at the time, which I added to his food, and after that he was able to eat a normal diet. He was always a fussy eater, and did have intermittent bouts of loose poo if he ate anything new.

I would be inclined to ask the vet for blood tests, and as Lankeela says would let the breeder know. If you are like me you will want to keep him anyway, but a good breeder may offer to take him back if he has a health problem, especially if it is going to cost you an arm and a leg to put right. Hope you got him insured?

[Julz08]

Hi All,

Thanx so much for all of your advice, It's great to know I'm not alone on this. Will try cutting out the mashed potato and see how that works. Tokyo says thanx Leelapops for the cuddle and so sorry about the Mousse description!!!!

Woofgang: He's putting on weight, coat is shiny and he's really lively. I'm always in the garden with him when he's out there and haven't noticed him eating anything he shouldn't yet, there's still time for that tho!!!! Sorry to hear about you two pups, what's so tasty about horse pooh, gosh don't some pups have some weird tastes but then I hear the New Forest is beautiful, it must be a better class of horse pooh there!!!!!!!!

Lankeela: It's still a fun time with Tokyo and he is learning really well, he is so easy to teach which is fantastic and very rewarding. Must admit he's not been drinking as much since being on this diet, he drank far more when on the kibble but I've put than down to kibble being dry food and there is quite alot of moisture in this diet, He has fresh water available at all times and is not showing signs of dehydration.

Jules77: So sorry to hear of your of your loss:-( Yes am insured. Have contacted breeder but she is away at the moment and await a reply to see if she has had any problems like this with her other dogs. I have no worries that she would take him back but he's staying right here. It's amazing how quickly we bonded and love him too much to send him back so will stick this out with him and see what the vet says on Monday, will mention to him about the blood tests, thanks. We are very lucky to have such a great practice here and I know Tokyo is in good hands with them.

Will keep you informed of Tokyo's progress.
Julz08

[woofgang]

Julz, how's the pup doing??

[Julz08]

Hi Woofgang,

He is doing great thanx, took him off the chicken and gave him white fish and rice, he loves it, poops have firmed up nicely too. Had a response from the breeder who was very helpful, although she had never experienced any of her other dogs or pups being upset by JW. Vet said to keep him on this diet for a while, said it could have been the chicken or that JW was just a bit too rich for him? I can start gradually introducing another brand of food if I wanted to feed him on kibble, it might just be trial & error but stick with it, lots of pups go through this apparently and then grow out of it. He gave him a clean bill of health and he's still putting on weight which is great, we do weigh him regularly and you only have to get the scales out now and he's on them, he'll be looking in the mirror next!!! My local pet centre advised trying him on either arden grange or nutro, I've emailed arden grange for some samples and the pet centre gave me samples of nutro but I haven't heard of this one before and am not sure of the quality, have been on their website but they're going to say how great it is, would be nice to find some independent reviews, do you know of any sites that give reviews on dog foods??
Tokyo has been out for the first time this week and has been brilliant. Have got him to sit and wait at the roadside and he doesn't move until I say it's ok to do so, I was really chuffed.
How are your two doing, keeping off the horse pooh I hope?!!!
Thanx again
Julz

[woofgang]

lovely to hear from you, sorry for the delay in replying and I am so glad that Tokyo is better. Mine are still two little devils, pretty good off lead but total mayhem on it!! still eating the poo but I have found a probiotic food additive with extra fibre in it that slows digestion and makes it more complete so they don't get the tum upsets or the puppy gas which frankly was getting to the no naked lights and fumigate everywhere stage!