My heart goes out to this mans poor family

[Nosha123]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7860 342.stm

Just awful.... what is wrong with these scum bags?

I had a conversation with the Husband recently and pleaded with him that if he ever gets challenged or confronted by anyone - or is in a situation that could turn nasty - even something as simple as someone cutting you up on the road that I want him to just walk away and ignore it.. and to not get involved...

You just dont know these days if the other person is carrying a weapon... and if you believe the news.. most under 25s ARE!!!

Just so sad... poor family...

[Gormless]

Better education? Develop your theme. How do you educate the ineducable?

[carrust]

Ooeeer, my daughter lives in Croydon, & she gets married to a Croydonite this year.

[anotheoldgit]

since it meant that if you were armed you were more likely to use the weapon since you were going to prison anyway.

Well if that is the type of logic we can expect from the Met? I depair, thank goodness he's no longer in the Met.

'5 Years' v 'a life sentence'?

[sleepyj]

very very sad .i think bring back the death sentence.

[Oneeyedvic]

AOG - no, a minimum or 5 years against a life sentance which could be as little as 15 years.

If you are going down for a 'long' period and you have to make a quick decision, it can turn out lots of different ways.

And how much time have you spent on the front line policing for you to also be in a position to judge his talents and thought processes?

[Oneeyedvic]

Better education? Develop your theme. How do you educate the ineducable?

In a forum that takes a maximum of 2000 characters - that's really not going to work. If you ever come up to Norfolk, I would happily buy you a beer or two and sit in a pub and discuss it..... :)

[jake-the-peg]

Well I must say that if I've made AOG feel sick today at least I've achieved something!

The point is we all know the papers distort stuff - even Nosha alludes to it in the question.

And yes he's right it does depend what pert of the country you live in and what you do.

Your greatest chance of being a victim of violent crime is if you're a young man, so getting your husbands to realise that if the worst ever happened, fighting because of pride is really really dumb.

I teach Karate and my instructor once said to me "You don't win a fight, you survive one"

First try and talk, then try and run and only fight if you have no other option.

But whatever you do don't let the journalists frighten you - that's what they want - they want to paint a dramatic end-of-the-world story because:
a) it sells papers and
b) their owners have political aims

and if they terrify you half to death in achieving them - they really couldn't give a monkeys

[Gormless]

What thought processes are going on in "You lookin at me mate?" or "Got 20p for the phone mate?" or "Got a light mate?"

Pedal hard, get home, shut the door, reflect on how great multicultural Britain has become.

[Nosha123]

Aaah so oneyedvic is from Norfolk....

Perhaps that is why he lacks the understanding required from those of us living 'down south' and near the violent suburbs or London such as West Croydon.

i repeat onedeyedvic - have you been to Tooting lately or Southall? Try it... the 15 year olds there are much more likely to be 'tooled' up than in Norfolk.
I agree with Gormless.. despite his name.. he talks some sense!

Oneyedvic quotes "that the automatic 5 year jail sentence of people carrying a gun was one of the worst decisions for policing - since it meant that if you were armed you were more likely to use the weapon since you were going to prison anyway. "

They do have a choice!!!! They can choose NOT to carry a weapon... We all have choices in life.. and some make the wrong ones causing others to suffer and they need to pay the price - or else where is the deterrent?
police have too much

[Oneeyedvic]

Pedal hard, get home, shut the door, reflect on how great multicultural Britain has become.

Yep, all down to multi cultural Britain.

This sort of thing never happened in the 60s and 70s, Mods, Rockers, etc

There was never any problems in our ancestry - Roundheads - who are they?

And of course, we don't talk about Scotland (the Knife capital of Europe) - it's all the foreigners init

[Nosha123]

multi-cultural society can be born and grow here in the UK.... not necessarily immigrants though maybe from an immigrant parentage... so not 100% foreigners...

I would think you are referring to those of a different ethinic culture... black.. asian.. whatever.... oneyedvic.

And London is a more multi-cultural city than most - so yes there are more of them.. there is also more poverty.. more single parents.. poor education poor quality homing... lack of respect for authority... respect amongst peers.. hence gang culture...!

[Gormless]

Come now OEV, the problem is far far worse than it ever was. Whereabouts in Norfolk are you? Rural I hope, for your sake. I would love to come up there and have a drink with you.

Do visit West Croydon and Tooting at night. By day, wonderful, loads of ethnic shops and superbly multicultural, after dark, don't go there!

The gun/knife problem is not entirely a Black problem, but it is almost entirely so. It is cultural and is not going away. The police are powerless.

[Oneeyedvic]

Aaah so oneyedvic is from Norfolk.... - Well, i live in Norfolk. I was born in St Albans and lived in Bedford and Northampton as well. I live in Great Yarmouth and live in the 3% most deprived areas of the country.

Just had a short break in London (6 days) staying in Aldgate and last year we stayed in Hounslow. Funnily enough this stay we tubed over to Hounslow as my wife wanted to go shopping there.

Do you actually understand why young people carry knives. It is very easy to sit there and say "Everyone has a choice". Do they?

Have you been to a council estate where kids going to school are spat on and beaten up? Have you not been able to sleep at night because your lodger is having an all night party? Have you been told to hold this stolen gear for someone otherwise he will kill you?

If you are terrified to walk out of the front door as you may be mugged by a gang, what would you do? Go out or maybe try and carry a weapon to defend yourself.

[Sgt.Rock]

Don't tell me - stabbed by a black teenager for not showing nuff ree-spect (looked at him the wrong way that is).

[anotheoldgit]

Oneeyedvic

Do you think commenting on how you used to collect Nazi badges to someone who lost family in the Holocaust would be sick?

Wow! fancy having to go back one year to try and make a ridiculous comparison as this, it beggers belief, and only goes to highlight what lengths you will go to to make your stupid points.

For your information and seeing that you have very little knowledge of life's experiences. During and soon after WW2 many people collected military memorabilia, badges, flags, uniform and even weapons.

These could be Nazi, Italian, Japanese even those of the allies, it did not make them in any way insensitive. Are you suggesting in your loony left way that perhaps all museums should now be cleared of such things, in case it causes an offence to someone?

So you see it makes you look rather silly to makes these kind of stupid comparisons.

[Gormless]

This discussion has gone a few full circles now. For OEV it's down to kids carrying weapons to protect themselves. The argument makes sense, truly it does, Britain's schools becoming mini-armies, police on duty at the gates while the battles are fought out by the warriors.

It is so sad and futile, but no government or police force can ever change the way cultures think innit.

We need to pour more public funds into educating the ineducable.

[Oneeyedvic]

No AOG, I am suggesting that a person who collects memorabilia of a group of people who were responsible for one of the biggest atrocities is (in my opinion) more sick that a person who puts on a website a fact that you are more likely to be killed in other western countries that in this one.

I apologise for referring back to a year ago in a post but I do have a good memory. There was also a more recent link to one of your posts which you have neglected to mention.

You changed JTP's original post to make it sound cruel and callous to the widow of the victim.

I am simply pointing out that you have put more callous remarks on this site.