broadmoor and rampton

[tali122]

if im correct broadmoor and rampton hold some of uk's most dangerous people- who i assume are not locked up all the time and are allowed various educational /recreational activities- so are staff armed as they are are surrounded by violent/unpredictable attackers who could strike at any second?
i mean its cant be the most relaxing enviroment to work in- being at the threat of death during your working day

[acw]

Not all staff are armed no.  But there are very good safeguards in place and staff injuries are rare in prisons.  I think it must be a stressful environment.  But then police and even, sadly, hospital staff face violence every day.  It's becoming more common.  :-(  Prison officers do a great job though - I really admire anyone that works in a prison. 

[kempie]

Just to clarify the point, Broadmoor and Rampton (along with Ashworth) are hospitals for the criminally insane but they enforce security equivalent to that of a category B prison.

However the different prison categories for adult male prisoners are:

• Category A is for prisoners whose escape would be considered highly dangerous to the public, or a threat to national security.
• Category B is for prisoners for whom escape must be made very difficult.
• Category C applies to prisoners who cannot be trusted in open conditions.
• Category D prisoners can be reasonably trusted in open conditions.

Un-convicted adult prisoners (commonly referred to as Remand prisoners) will generally be treated as Category B prisoners.

From this we can infer that the 'criminally insane' are not highly dangerous to the public should they escape.

[mystress]

What we must remember about the Inmates of such Institutions is,they all have a very narrow "window" of killing.

Take two examples:~

Sutcliffe:~ The "Yorkshire Ripper",he only killed women who were prositutes,or appeared to be prostitutes;so who would he kill,or be disturbed by in Hospital?

Nielsen:~ Who killed several young Gay guys.Again,where would he come across such guys in Hospital that would stir him up?

I could quote many more examples,but I won't bore you.Just think on this.The staff in these Hospitals are trained in combat and defending themselves.More importantly they are trained to be very aware of an inmates eye contact,facial looks,body language and general behaviour patterns.If there is anything out of the ordinary they will spot it believe me.

I agree that it cannot be a pleasant job(at Rampton & Broadmoor) but I firmly believe that Prison Warders in a General Prison are far more likely to be injured or attacked,as these prisoners are far less predictable that the ones in Rampton and Broadmoor).

[hinge1967]

I think it is important to point out that the majority of staff at the Special Hospitals are Health Care Professionals of which the majority are Registered Mental Health Nurses. I'm an RN (Mental Health) myself, and visited Broadmoor during my training. All the staff I spoke to there indicated that the secure environment of the hospital was far less dangerous than people believed, and I know that many of my colleagues who work in secure environments say they would not do my job (a Community Mental health Nurse) for fear of their safety. It fascinates me that even my professionally trained colleagues start believing all the myths that exist about mental illess.

I think its very important to recognise that recorded violence commited by people with mental illness is really statistically quite low when compared to those of the "well" population. Interestingly violent crime by people with mental illness has not increased over the last 50 years while it has amongst the "well" population. Media reporting of murder by people with Mental illness on National News has significantly increased, while many murders by "well" people are often only locally reported. Draw your own conclusions!

[tali122]

im sure there must be those at rampton/broadmoor unlike the serial killers mentioned who "snapped" and killed without motive and i assume they must be a danger to staff for their schizophrenic unpredictability or perhaps general sadistic tendancies

[acw]

tali - please re-read the answers.  People who really know what they're talking about have given factual statements that illustrate that the job is far safer than you imagine.  Of COURSE there will be instances of violence.  But then I work behind a bar at a football ground and one customer offered to kick my teeth in a few weeks ago.  People encounter violence in many different jobs.  The staff of Broadmoor and Rampton are trained professionals with huge expertise in dealing with people with mental illness. 

If you want us all just to agree with you - you're barking up the wrong tree.

[hinge1967]

tali122,

Can I also say that, although I understand your concerns, you need keep them in perspective. Those detained against their will in Broadmoor and Rampton are indeed considered dangerous, however they are a small minority of those who experience mental illness. Unpredictabilty is a feature of some people who suffer from mental disorder but it often causes more distress to those experiencing it than it does to the general public. Unpredictability is almost always a response to either external or internal (eg hearing voices that incessantly criticise them without relief) stresses. In my experience people with a mental illness become violent when they feel (or are in being) frightened or threatened. The role of health care staff within institutions such as Broadmoor or Rampton and your local Psychiatric Unit (or even the Priory!!!) is to assist the person to reduce those stresses and therefore the distress experienced by the person. This is acheived through therapy, medication and safe and secure environments.

There has always been an argument that psychiatric institutions do as much to protect the unwell from the stress of society as they do to protect society from the unwell. They offer asylum in its true sense.

There is a danger that the myth that all people with mental illness will lash out further stigmatises people who are already isolated, frightened, feel threatened, vulnerable and in need of help. Its an extra stress they just don't need.

[twiglet4frog]

i live about 15 to 20 mins from rampton and i have never been in obviously but i have to say that it does look very secure. there are huge metal white gates everywhere that are patrolled just to gain entry to the area.

Ian Huntly and Beverly Allitt were two murderers that have had stays in Rampton at one time and in the case of Ian Huntly it was announced at the time that he was heavily sedated at all times to make sure they are not a risk to anyone and in a padded cell with cardboard furniture to protect both himself and others who enter!

[kempie]

twiglet4frog - how is it obvious that you have never been inside Rampton?  ;-}

[tali122]

no,no,no, maybe my wording is clumsy - i am simply curious that is all- i am not trying to make anyone agree with me- i am just adding in scenarios- i am not arguing with the points put forward one iota
acw so it was you behind the bar i threatened at the football match !- (it was your body language that made me angry)

[acw]

Tali - I now have no idea what you're talking about. All I can say is that the comment about kicking my teeth in was something that I didn't hear but that my colleagues told me had happened.  If I had heard it, I would have happily ensured that the culprit got barred from that, and all football grounds for life. 

I'm glad you're taking on board the comments about mental health.  It's an issue that affects more people than perhaps you realise.  And a very sensitive issue too.  Not all mentall ill people are dangerous lunatics - I'm glad you see that.  :-)

[tali122]

acw ,its just occured to me that what you could have possibly done to upset the person threatening you?- surely of all people not you?no thats crazy
what next gary lineker - a baby eating satanist?

[spat]

As a Charge Nurse of over 15 years experience and having worked within most psychiatric settings across the country I have to agree with hinge

You are much more likely to be injured on a night out in your local town centre on a Friday night. and statiscally you are more likely to be murdered by your partner than anyone who would qualify for a stay in any of the state hospitals

risk is continually assessed in psychiatry-risk to the public and risk to self that the ill person may have