National speed limit

[Scylax]

Many years ago, when I first studied the Highway Code, a large white circular road sign with a diagonal black stripe indicated 'Derestriction'. Obviously, no-one believed that any vehicle could possibly exceed 70mph.. Times change, and now that same sign indicates that national speed-limits apply. Now, since all roads have national speed-limits, why do we still have that obsolete sign ?

[sddsddean]

The national speed limit is not necessarily 70mph. It is different on different types of road, and different for different vehicles on the same stretch of road, so thats why you have a derestriction sign. ( Too many 'differents' for my liking!!)

[Toureman]

It's not a deristriction sign, it means do not exceed 70 mph depending on what vehicle you are using..

[razza]

The national speed limit is 70 mph,that means you cannot do more than 70mph on any type of road,which is usually motorways and dual carriageways.Any other speed limit for any particular road is designated as such by the display of speed limits.

[Hopkirk]

Why do you say it is obsolete?

When you leave an area with a lower speed limit, you need to be told that national speed limits apply to you now.

Those speeds vary depending on the type of road you are on, and the type of vehicle you are driving.

Despite the previous answers, it is only 70 in a few cases.

[Prudie]

The national speed limit on a de-restricted standard road is 60 mph

[Hopkirk]

If you mean a single carriageway for a car, then yes Prudie.

Also 50 mph for a coach or bus, and 40 mph for a lorry

[Prudie]

Yes I did and of course you're right, I was only thinking cars but I remember all those other vehicles came up on my speed awareness course!

[New Judge]

I hope you’ve already passed your test, razza.

“...you cannot do more than 70mph on any type of road,which is usually motorways and dual carriageways.”

In a car it is ONLY motorways and dual carriageways where the national speed limit is 70mph (lower for some types of vehicles).

“Any other speed limit for any particular road is designated as such by the display of speed limits.”

Not so. On single carriageway roads where the national speed limit of 60mph applies (again, lower for some vehicles) this is indicated by the national speed limit sign, not a 60mph sign.

[THECORBYLOON]

Different vehicles have dfferent speed limits depending on the type of road. Having one sign makes more sense than having multiple signs for each type of vehicle

[Scylax]

All the above answers noted.... thank you all. A nagging doubt yet remains .... if
statutory speed-limits apply to all roads, be they 30, 40, 50, 60 or 70mph., in the absence of contrary signs, why have this specific marker ? It seems a bit redundant to me. It's a bit like the noticeboard set high on the Yorkshire moors which says:' Do not throw stones at this noticeboard'.

[R1Geezer]

It's not redundant, the speed limit has to be marked on all roads without it how would you indicate that a speed restiction is over? There is a section of dual carraigeway near me that is 50 limit, at the end of that section is a national speed limit sign, how else would you indicate that the limit is now the national limit?

[rov1100]

The problem with speed limits in this country is that there are too many of them. How many times have you driven along a road not being aware if you should keep to 30, 40 or whatever as similar roads have different controls.

If you travel in France on non motorway roads you know before approaching a village it is 30 when you enter and a sign to tell you you are leaving the area at the other end. Simplicity without confusion!

[R1Geezer]

you mean like a speed limit sign at the start of the village and one a the end. wow those French are advanced aren't they!

[Buenchico]

The key point about the national speed limit sign is that it can't be replaced by a single specific speed sign. For example, on a single carriageway a car driver has to read the sign as '60mph', unless he's towing a caravan or trailer - in which case (along with the drivers of transit-type vans and buses) he has to read it as '50mph', whereas a truck driver has to read it as '40mph'.

So, if you were to get rid of the old 'derestricted' sign, what would you replace it with?

Chris

[Scylax]

Yes, R1Geezer & co. I take your point. Of course one has to know when a previous restriction, say 40 mph., has ended, and less restrictive national speed limits apply, but I always thought that these previous restrictions required regular reminders, in the form of smaller signs. In the absence of these I've always assumed that national speed limits were again in force, without the need for a specific sign. Maybe I assume too much, or the authorities are merely doing a belt-and-braces job. No harm either way.

[R1Geezer]

even the national speed limit signs have repeaters. Do you accept that this is not an "obselete sign" now?

[Scylax]

OK, OK, R1Geezer, obsolete it terms of meaning derestriction - its original meaning -
not obsolete in meaning newer restrictions apply. Almost semantic, but I'm happy to see reason anytime.

[Hippy]

On the 22nd December, 1965 the then Transport Minister, Tom Fraser, introduced the 70mph limit on motorways and other de-restricted roads. There had been a multiple vehicle pile up in fog the previous autumn and this was a measure to make the motorways safer.

It was a temporary restriction to see if it would work, but just like Income Tax before it, this measure was made permanent by Fraser's successor, Barbara Castle.

This seemed to have little effect, as the pile-ups continued to happen. In 1970 100 vehicles crashed on the A1 just north of Doncaster, In 1971 50 vehicles piled up on the M1 near Bedford the same day as 26 crashed in Derbyshire on the same road.

Since then the government have introduced ever more restrictive speed limits in its attempt to make us all safer. Or could it be that it knows that motorists will more easily fall foul of the limits near a laser gun toting copper and generate a tidy income in fines? Surely not.

[sddsddean]

With 'repeater' signs Scylax its the other way round. If there are no repeaters (40, 50 etc), then the 30 limit applies. Of course, the problem is that repeaters go 'missing' due to accidents, roadworks, theft etc.