Union Flat or Union Jack?

[smurfchops]

Is this more political correctness? It now seems to be called the Union Flag instead of the Union Jack. Was Jill unamused?

[jake-the-peg]

Has there been any actual instance of the flag being used as a distress signal by flying upside down?

Outside of 50's Boys Own comics and Old copies of Scouting for Boys ?

This seems like one of those things that people get het up about and I can't work out why - seems perhaps it was something taught to them in their youth and the fact that nobody under the age of 40 (and many over) don't seem to care appears to somehow strike at some set of values they hold

[jno]

probably not.

http://www.crwflags.c...tw/flags/xf-flip.html

Upside down is still upside down, though and therefore wrong; it's just harder to spot than on, say, the US flag.

[jake-the-peg]

Well who decided that was the right way up to start with? a bunch of 18th century design consultants?

Is this a case of "perceived wisdom" handed down over the centuries with no real basis in fact?

[jno]

I've no idea who exactly, but Garter King of Arms or one of his minions, presumably - heraldry's their job, isn't it? It didn't just arrange itself; heraldry's been a very precise business for a long time.

[humbersloop]

Early doors it probably was jake, but not recently. The distress idea is that you did anything unusual to attract passing attention and assistance, so the flag was an obvious candidate.

The Americans have the same tradition, I believe, but it depends how complicated the flag is for it to have that effect. Naff all use, for example to fly the French or Dutch flags upside down and catch anyone's eye.

The disrespect question is because the Union Flag is actually Brenda's personal flag Britain uses by convention as it's national flag.

There's tumbleweed in pedant's corner I must go and check...

[humbersloop]

The national crosses are stacked up in the order of, ahem, joining Great Britain, saltire cross at the back.

[ChuckFickens]

Sailors from Indonesia or Poland would be a little stuffed if they had to fly their flags upside down to indicate distress too.

[jno]

likewise drowning Libyans under Gadaffi. Fortunately the all-green flag has been dumped.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_flag

[ChuckFickens]

Trying to distinguish between a sinking ship from the ivory coast or a happy, healthy ship from Ireland could be problematic too.

[humbersloop]

http://en.wikipedia.o...time_distress_signals

Running around in circles, waving your arms wildly and screaming blue murder is not an internationally recognised signal - though it may have some resonance - but it makes you feel better.

[jno]

no need to scream blue murder, just say pan pan three times.

[humbersloop]

lol jno

[dannyk13]

Ludwig. What a prat!

[humbersloop]

Is that a question danny??

[dannyk13]

Ludwig. What a prat!

[dannyk13]

No, a statement

[Old_Geezer]

It was first designed with the white stripe at the top so that defines the correct way up. It isn't difficult, and clearly fact.

I guess there are worse things to do, but can you imaging other countries not feeling peeved if you flew their flag upside down ? So why should our union flag be any different ?

Oh and yes, the navy has jacks that they fly from their jackstaff, the rest of us call them flags and fly them from a flagpole. Nowt to do with being PC, simply with being correct.

[New Judge]

Quite, OG. Wishing to be seen as “correct” (not to be confused with “politrically correct”) in 2012 is seen as some sort of statement of superiority, smugness or class division. It is nothing of the sort. I won’t grace ludwig’s crass comment with the luxury of a reply, Nor will comment on jake’s fatuous contention that the flag’s correct presentation was the whim of some 18th century design consultants except to say this: far from being the result of a whim or “perceived wisdom”, the different widths of the white bands of the Scottish cross of St Andrew are displayed so as to give precedence to that cross (because it was incorporate into the flag first) over the red cross of St Patrick. It thus has a right and wrong side up which, whilst a bit more complicated than the Stars and Stripes, is nonetheless just as important.

The “...fact that nobody under the age of 40 (and many over) don't seem to care” is probably more due to the fact that those same people don’t even know that the flag can be flown upside down and less to do with any set of values those that do know hold. Unfortunately, rather than saying “thanks for pointing that out to me. I’ll make sure I get it right next time”, excuses have to be found for ignorance today and denigration of those with “unreasonable knowledge” naturally follows.