parking fines on pensnett trading estate

[silverdaler]

my son parked outside Greggs to buy a sandwich on this trading estate where he works sometime in December. at the end of Feb he received a letter from A S Securi-t who are a private firm contracted (they claim) to monitor the site. With the letter was a fine for �75 for parking on a single yellow line. attached was a poor quality digital photo of his car taken from round the corner, obviously by someone sitting craftily out of sight in his car. shouldnt he have been issued with a ticket or something ? anyone had similar experience or got any advice. he has to settle within 2 weeks or it goes up to �100 ! expensive sandwich !!!!!!!!

[markja]

was gregs on the trading estate? if they are then he should be able to use their premises. also if he works on the estate i would think that he is allowed to take his car on it. single yellow lines mean nothing on private land, only on public roads.send them a letter stating that he works on the estate, was visiting that unit, and was stopped (not parked )legally. i work for dhl and one of our vans was delivering to w.h.smiths when one of these parking photos was taken and alleged parking fine incured. these people are robbers/theives/ scumbags.

[stanleyman]

I don't think private firms are empowered to issue or collect private fines. I think it is unenforcable.

[bluejonjo]

Watchdog on BBC had a feature on this last week. Its a bit of a grey area apparently.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/consumer/tv_and_radio/watchdog/repo rts/transport/transport_20060228.shtml

Take em to court. I would. They have to obtain your details from the DVLA which could be a contravention of the data protection act.

To release data the DVLA have to be satisfied the person has a genuine requirement to persure the crime. As its only a single yellow it might not justify it in this case.

Another get out is unsatisfactory warning signs.

Its a scandal these scum can get your details for �2.50.

[silverdaler]

interesting answers - thanks. we now have to decide what to do - we have challenged them by letter once stating that he was actually still in the car at the time waiting for the car in front to move so he could park further down but they have written back saying pay up or else ! he is just in the process of buying his first house so the threat of court action etc scares him. on the other hand, he really cant afford this right now. you are right, they are low-life. i feel like going round myself and letting all their tyres down !!!!!!!

[silverdaler]

by the way markja, greggs is on the trading estate. they have large signs on some of the entrances to the esate but not on the entrance which my son uses. there is a notice near Greggs but as usual it is high up, small writing etc. he has now discovered that 3 people in his office have been done in the same place and paid up !

[JudgeJ]

Car parks such as you describe are �public roads� as far as the various Road Traffic Acts are concerned. This means you need to have a driving licence, Vehicle Excise Licence and Insurance to use them. Nonetheless, as far as parking regulations are concerned they are private land. Any charges (and they are charges, not fines � only courts can impose fines) allegedly due and not paid are civil debts and would have to be pursued through the County Court system.

The plaintiff (i.e. �A S Securi-t� would have to prove at least two things: firstly that the charges were made clear to drivers and secondly that a charge was justified in this particular case � that is that your son used the land in a way that was subject to a charge. It is also unjustified for the charge to be increased if not settled within a set period. Councils can do this with parking penalties because it is set down in law. Private companies cannot. It is rather like you Gas supplier threatening to double your gas bill if it is not paid on time. They may be able to claim interest at the going rate, but that�s all.

Your son should refuse to pay this charge until he is satisfied that it is justified. If he is not convinced that it is he should invite Securi-t to take him to court. There are times when you have to make a stand. A County Court hearing is nothing to fear and you may find that faced with such action Securi-t will back down.

[silverdaler]

wow , thanks JudgeJ, you sound pretty clued up. i might have a go at fighting this now - Cheers !!!

[markja]

not that i'd ever sugest doing it. what would happen if a load of people (not neccasseraly[?] those that have had tickets off these bozos) were to sneak up and cover the camera mans car in paint? making sure they didn't get any paint on themselves so no proof who did it.

also every time you see some one parking in these places tell them about the sh*t with the camera. i do this for the cameras on the street coz hamersmith and fulham council are r*bbing bl**ders. they've lost so much money off of drivers who i point cameras out to they probably wish they'd never ticketed me!

i'm not bitter and twisted, much.

[silverdaler]

i think youre a hero markja. if you are ever in the midlands theres a free pint for you !

[DirtyHabit]

I would also complain to Greggs, telling them that their customers are being targeted and that you will make sure that you tell as many people as possible. This company know that as a sandwich shop it will be used by many of the worker on the estate. It is a big site, so some will use their cars to collect sandwiches. The shop is a "Honeytrap" and Greggs customers are the Bee's.

[silverdaler]

thats a good point dirty habit - i will make sure he does that - it might not help him but it could help others in the future. thanks

[silverdaler]

my son has just pointed out that the warning signs about parking are posted on some of the entances to the trading estate but not all of them. as it happens, the entrance which is closest to his work does not have any notices. could this be used as a valid excuse do you think ?

[silverdaler]

Wouldnt you know it........ just when we think we have got them, we have been to take photo's today of the shop (where there were no signs about parking restrictions) and hey presto - brand spanking new signs up everywhere ! sods law ! oh well - thanks for all your help everyone