Secret Lives Of Farm Animals

[bainbrig]

Just seen last night's episode of the Secret Life of Farm Animals. Amazing, incredible, see it on catch-up if you missed it (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0001jgg).

I've always liked cows, but had no idea that they organised their own creches (when left alone to do so), or that they liked music!

My only real question is: "How, having seen programmes like this, can people STILL eat animals, knowing that they are sensitive, caring, sentient beings - and not, as most meat-eaters would like to believe, just a special sort of plant that moves around?"

BillB

[Old_Geezer]

Easy. They are food.

Did you know that plants detect when they are being eaten ? How could people eat them knowing that ?

[bainbrig]

Yes, the old chestnut, geezer. Plants scream when you cut them, etc.

But we are talking SENTIENT beings, with social groupings, and what could be defined as a 'culture'.

Watch the programme, and then tell me they're just bits of food walking about.

BB

[Old_Geezer]

Very few things are "just" one thing. But food is still food.
Look at nature, it'll show what's what, if one hasn't become oversensitive.

[hereIam]

I couldn't watch this because I knew it would show them in a way that would make the fact that they are going to be slaughtered even harder to bear, particularly when you hear about the cruel treatment often meted out to them before death by slaughterhouse workers. And yes, I'm a meat eater except for pigs and lamb, so I know I'm a big hypocrite.

[ummmm]

hereIam - it doesn't make you a hypocrite. Just someone with feelings.

How many people have switched from battery chicken to free range after the appalling conditions of battery farming was exposed? If you're going to eat an animal lets hope it had the best life possible.

BB - read 'The Secret Life of Plants'

[bainbrig]

Ummmm. No, ("BB - read 'The Secret Life of Plants'") I won't, at least not until people who TELL me to read it watch this programme and those like it, and then justify their eating of fellow-beings.

Old Geezer's attitude might be questionable, but philosophically it's sound - he sees animals as inferior beings. Is that YOUR stance?

[ummmm]

I don't need to watch programmes like that. Our uncle is a shepherd and FIL is a dairy farmer. Doesn't stop them eating meat.

[AuntLydia]

The problem with these programmes, like a lot of wildlife programmes is that they disneyfy animals. Yes, cows will look after other babies in the herd as do a lot of animals, but they will attack without caution a strange calf trying to suckle. Sheep will butt off lambs and pigs will kill their own piglets, so its not all cuddles down on the farm. Animals only have three motivations, reproduction, food and safety from predators.
This is why I avoid programmes like this, aimed at those who know little about real farm animals. Another fallacy is that farmers are 'cruel'. I have yet to meet a cruel farmer, and have seen many grown men reduced to tears because they have lost a calf or lambs.

[bainbrig]

I would like to discuss animal sentience, and why people think they have a right to slaughter and eat animals.

I’m not sentimentalising the process. It strikes me as very clear - either animals have an equal right to life, or they don’t. Old Geezer says they don’t. I wish more people would be as honest - I might not LIKE Geezer’s position, but at least it’s a valid one.

[ummmm]

You're preaching!!

[AuntLydia]

Bainbrig: humans breed animals for food. The sole purpose for this breeding is for food or reproduction of the herd. Before farming we hunted animals for food. The farm animals would not have a life if they were not bred, they would not exist, so as such have no 'rights'. If all the people in the UK decided in one go to become vegetarian or vegan, cows sheep and pigs would disappear from the UK. They cannot live independently like wild animals can, they would starve. One day in the distant future, I would like to think we will no longer feel the need to kill animals for food, but until that day the best we can do is make sure the animals bred for food are treated with compassion.
https://www.ciwf.org.uk/about-us/

[bainbrig]

Ummm. No. I’m asking for a frank, open debate.

But what I get from thelikes of Lydia is a restatement of an already stated position, and that is NOT a debate, but rather a challenge to a fight.

Not interested.

[Old_Geezer]

Already stated as the discussion has been had before. These are the reasons one believes you are mistaken.

It is unreasonable to give all species the same status and rights. In extreme, a virus can not be murdered, cockroaches have no right to a family life, etc.. There has to be a hierarchy. Intelligence, the ability to reason, (amongst other characteristics) puts us at the top, other species are on lower tiers with fewer rights. Since life feeds on life, many are the food of other species; and so it is with cows and humans.

[Baldric]

BB,
your link is not working, could you maybe try again please?

[AuntLydia]

a challenge to fight! My god you are scraping the barrel bainbrig. I would not waste my typing fingers.

[-Talbot-]

So should we eat animals like Dolphins, chimps and lions then?

[Baldric]

P eople
E ating
T asty
A nimals

[nailit]

Bainbrig,
Only really scanned the answers so far but I really wish I didn't have to eat animals. (or animal products)
Have experimented with different diets over the years and trying a vegan diet for a few weeks was great insofar as my health/emotions etc were concerned. Just couldn't keep it up, wish I could.

[bainbrig]

Link again.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m0001jgg

Hope it works (it does for me!)

BB

[AZardoz]

Those self-righteous vegans might have to face the harsh reality that they are killing other life-forms when they eat their kale.