Mental Health Act 1983

[Tilly2]

This is a serious question.
Does anyone know, with any certainty, when someone has been detained under section 3 of the M.H.A, they are eligible for NHS funding when the detention is lifted?

[woofgang]

Seriously, they neither would definitely be or definitely not be. It would depend on the assessment of their needs and abilities.

[Tilly2]

Thanks, woofgang. I know there will need to be an assessment done. I was trying to find something concrete before I went into it with the PCT.

[woofgang]

are they saying they deffo will not fund because of the section order?

[woofgang]

pressed submit too soon, sorry. Either he will receive a successful treatment while sectioned and then not need to have the section extended and will need reassessing as to his needs and abilities, or during the time of detention, he will not improve and therefore the section order will need to be extended. Section 3 is serious Sugar!

[Tilly2]

I havent contacted the PCT yet ,woof. I was trying to find out if anyone else had had the same experience. According to my research over the weekend, it seems to me that the NHS should be funding a person once they have been sectioned.

[Tilly2]

I know section 3 is serious. It happened to my Dad.

[woofgang]

Well while they are in hospital, surely the NHS is funding them? Once they are ok to be discharged, then the circs have to be reassessed. Its the same as someone with a physical illness, you don't say while they are in hospital "you are ill now, therefore you are eligible for NHS funding when you leave regardless of how you are functioning at that point".
Or am i misunderstanding something here?

[Tilly2]

It's to do with mental health issues which remain with the patient.
I'll contact the PCT and talk to them. Thanks for trying to help, woof.

[ummmm]

//Well while they are in hospital, surely the NHS is funding them?//

^^not always. Some people are self funding.

If they were NHS funded to start with then they will continue to be funded until they are not considered to be a risk to themselves or others.

[woofgang]

Yes thats what you need to do. Even if a million people posted on here and said that their reli had or had not been entitled to NHS funding after being sectioned under section 3, that still wouldn't mean that the person that you are talking about would or would not be entitled as well.

[ummmm]

They don't section people and let them out when initial funding is up.

[woofgang]

How can you self fund in an NHS hospital? i didn't think that the secure units had private facilities. If you are talking about someone who goes from self funded res care to hospital then my answer stands and an assessment will be needed when the person is ready to leave hospital. I assumed from the OP's question that the person was not already being funded in res care by the NHS as then given what we have been told about the circs and barring a miracle recovery, funding would continue.

[woofgang]

They don't section people and let them out when initial funding is up.
sorry ummmmm, not understanding this?

[bednobs]

if your PCT is not very helpful, try the PALS service

[ummmm]

Private hospitals take NHS patients. They don't turf patients out. They do an assessment and if it's decided that they patient needs to be retained further then they bill the NHS.

[woofgang]

Oh sorry Ummm I see. Yes if patient still isn't well, and is NHS funded in a private hospital, the NHS have to keep paying or find them a place in an NHS hospital

[lcg]

hi, tilly. people are sectioned under the s3 of the mha when the are a risk to themselves, others, of self neglect or are not accepting treatment for their mental health disorder and their condition deteriorates/they have no insight into remaining well. when someone has been treated sufficiently, agree to stay informally in hospital and the are accepting of treatment and interventions offered by their consultant (or responsible clinician - rc) they still have the option of staying in hospital, but not under the restrictions of a section. this could be for a variety of reasons, including not having appropriate housing, carers not being able to cope or a longer period of recovery is required under supervision.

after discharge from hospital, patients can expect follow up discharge from home treatment teams for a short period - they offer intensive support and treatment in the first couple of weeks after discharge, and then monitoring by a community mental health team with the possibility of psychological therapies or other care needs being met. i am a mental health nurse, teach medical students on their psychology rotation, have carers experience (my hubby has been sectioned) and mental health problems myself.....so if you want further support or advice i would be glad to give it to you - particularly if you are not getting much support or communication. i have subscribed to this thread and will keep an eye on it for a few days and you can, quite literally, ask me anything x

[lcg]

sorry - i also meant to add that being sectioned or staying in hospital informally shouldn't cost a patient anything. even appeals against a section and the cost of legal representation during this is provided by the health trust. ANY mental health treatment is free of charge, including psychotherapy. hth....x

[Tilly2]

Hi icg, What I am trying to find out is all pertaining to my Dad. He has been in a care home for eight years, having spent some time in the local psychiatric hospital after a suicide attempt.
During the last eight years,he has had reccurencies of his problems and has been into the psychiactric hospital at different times for different periods of time.
In 2009 he was sectioned under section 3 and on his 'recovery' went back to his care home and is now an outpatient.
My Dad pays a part of his care home fees and social services pay the rest. I pay a top-up. Should my Dad be receiving NHS funding for continuing care as he obviously could not cope with living elsewhere?

[woofgang]

Is the care home a specialist one and does he receive any specialist care in it, either from the staff or from visiting NHS staff? If you declined to pay a top up, what would happen?