Abortion Referendum- Republic Of Ireland

[Hazi-Hammenuhoth]

Today is the day of the referendum on the Republic of Ireland's abortion laws.

The vote will decide whether to repeal a part of the constitution, known as the Eighth Amendment, which effectively bans non-essential terminations in the country.

Polls opened at 07:00 local time and votes can be cast until 22:00 tonight (Friday).

I wonder how the Irish will vote?

[Mamyalynne]

//in any circumstances//

That phrase always send shivers through me - but you Hazi are as entitled as anyone to your views.

[gness]

And I think you should have no right to vote on this, Hazi.....I think no man should...x

[kvalidir]

Under any circumstances? Seriously? So some poor child that has perhaps been raped by a relative should risk her life and then be forced to have the unbelievable trauma of deciding whether to keep her child or have it adopted (which has its own heartbreaking issues), or a child with no possible quality of life should have life inflicted upon it when it's loving parents realise it is in it's interests to terminate that life before it even properly begins? Are you actually insane?

[mccfluff]

being pro choice, doesn't mean you are pro abortion it simply means you support women being able to make their own choices. That is not illogical, whatever you believe personally.

I don't thing men should have a vote in this either.

[Zacs-Master]

'However if you see it as murder, as some people do, then it's completely illogical to say you'd never do it, but you're fine with it being done by other people.'

Thanks Ludwig, exactly what I meant.

[Zacs-Master]

It's Ok saying that men shouldn't have a vote but what about the scenario where the child would otherwise be in a loving relationship but the woman makes the decision to terminate on her own?

This is the trouble with a blanket vote. There are too many scenarios to consider for a simple yes/no answer.

[Hazi-Hammenuhoth]

I have no right to vote on it, gness, being from the UK. But I disagree that a man should not have an opinion whether or not an unborn child should be put to death.

Kvalidir- I am not insane (thanks for asking). I think your suggestion that to have a child put to death is preferable to adoption. My own mother was adopted- it is not for the parents to decided what quality of life the child will have. Are you insane?

[kvalidir]

My ex partner is adopted and very happily so. IF you bother to read what I wrote properly, you will see that I was referring to a child who would be born with painful disabilities when I said 'no quality of life'.
//or a child with no possible quality of life should have life inflicted upon it when it's loving parents realise it is in it's interests to terminate that life before it even properly begins?//
So I ask you, would you sentence a child to enduring unimaginable pain every day if you could prevent it's existence when it was still nothing more than an unaware cluster of cells?

[gness]

Then that would be the decision of the woman, Zacs.....and I can't see it being a good, loving relationship anyway if she had to do it without telling her partner....or...if she did tell him her decision....him trying to persuade her otherwise.

Yes, unplanned children who are perhaps not wanted at the beginning can end up having a wonderful life with loving parents who wouldn't want to change things now....
But a woman forced or persuaded to go through with a pregnancy she doesn't want is rarely going to make a happy mum...x

[ludwig]

Mcfluff // I don't thing men should have a vote in this either. //

Again, that depends on how you see it in the first place. If it's procedure done to women, there's no reason why anyone other than women should have a say on it.

For anyone that sees it as killing another human though, the question becomes 'should we legalise the murder of unborn children', which surely is something that everyone should be able to vote on, not just women.

I'm not arguing one way or the other here by the way, I'm pro-choice if anything.

[Zacs-Master]

Gness, there are many many couples who have children unexpectedly and love and care for that child just as much as a 'planned' one. Are you really saying that in those circumstances, the man has no say and therefore no right to vote?

[Islay]

With this scenario should a man have a say on if the wife should have a termination?
Couple been married for 10 years - wife falls pregnant but is being controlled and abused by the husband - she wants a termination because she knows what the child is in for - but obviously the husband doesn't want one as he has lost control over his wife - whose side do you take Hazi?

[Zacs-Master]

As I said......far too many scenarios of a simple yes/no vote.

[murraymints]

I , speaking as a Catholic, still think that the option of termination is, or should be, exclusively down to the person carrying the foetus... and it should be a fundamental right granted to each and every lady wherever she is domiciled...

[kvalidir]

But there has to be a simple yes or no vote, because at the moment women are being controlled, and in some cases dying ( not to mention fleeing to the UK like refugees) because of the law on abortion in Ireland.

[Zacs-Master]

That's fine.....for that scenario.

[ichkeria]

Just to be clear about what this is about: article 8 of the Irish constitution forbids abortion. Full stop. Unless a woman’s life is in danger: and even then, as Islay referred to above, the definition is subject to question and has led to deaths when the wrong decision has been made.
So the vote is to remove the constitutional connection between abortion - even for doomed foetuses - and the constitution, and that has to be the civilised thing to do.
Then proper legislation can proceed, but no one can do anything until the obligatory constitution-changing referendum has been held

[gness]

That's what I said about an unplanned pregnancy, Zacs.... as long as it's the woman's decision to go ahead and not abort.

NO voters are not only inflicting what they have no right to inflict upon a woman.....they are condemning some children to always being an unwanted child...and that's no bed of roses..x

[Cloverjo]

I had an unplanned pregnancy when I was young and skint. I chose to continue with the pregnancy, and have never regretted it. I am immensely grateful that I had the choice, being a UK citizen. The thought of having to give birth - no choice - is quite terrifying.

[woofgang]

I think that men should be able to vote.....but it does make me see red when I see men campaigning on the no side.