These Cases Get Even More Horrific.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2424335/Mummified-corpse-boy-4-mother-s-bedroom-TWO-YEARS-starved-death.html

It is reported that this person is to be charged with manslaughter, why is this not murder?

/// The prosecutor told the jury: 'She made no call for assistance - for a doctor or an ambulance.
'What did she do? Within hours she was ordering a pizza. So, no call for assistance but a call, or even calls, for pizza. ///

/// 'Moreover, she thereafter continued to claim child benefit in respect of her dead son.' ///

/// Mr Greaney said the jury will have to consider whether the pizza and the child benefit matters 'demonstrate anything about her attitude towards Hamzah'. ///

I wouldn't have thought there would be too much of a problem there.

[Zacs-Master]

a habitual cannabis smoker who drank a litre of vodka every day, slept each night.

[Sqad]

If he could have lasted another one year......he may well have had FREE school meals.

[hc4361]

Murder is the result of a deliberate action, not neglect.

[anotheoldgit]

hc4361

/// Murder is the result of a deliberate action, not neglect. ///

Isn't the act of starving someone until they die a deliberate act?

[sp1814]

Sidebar - I think she does crack or possibly crystal meth.

More likely it's crack.

[hc4361]

For a murder charge the accused must have done something rather than failed to something.

[Zacs-Master]

Instead of arguing the point AOG why don't you do a bit of research on what constitutes murder / manslaughter. You might come to the conclusion that the Law is an ass in cases like this. But it would stop pointless debate and you could ask the more pertinent Q; should the law be changed.

[albaqwerty]

manslaughter/murder, the child is still dead and died a horrible death due to someone who was supposed to look after him.

[Zacs-Master]

I think we all agree with that Alba. The question then arises as to the suitable punishment and I think AOG is wanting, as we all do, the harshest sentence possible.

[jake-the-peg]

Well it's not so obvious

If I kidnap someone and lock them in a room until they starve to death then there is deliberate action and we have Murder

This is after all what probably happened to Richard II

The CPS would have to establish whether there was a *deliberate intention* to starve someone to death to justify a murder charge.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_in_English_law#Mens_rea_.28intention.29

// for the defendant to have the mens rea of murder, there must be something more than mere foresight or knowledge that death or serious injury is a "natural" consequence of the current activities: there must be clear evidence of an intention //

[pixie373]

It's completely sick. I thought "manslaughter" was for unintentionally causing death. Starving a young child, even through neglect, is deliberate, because he will obviously die. What is wrong with these people?!

[hc4361]

I expect she has been charged with 'gross negligence manslaughter'.
Gross Negligence Manslaughter

This is where the death is a result of a grossly negligent (though otherwise lawful) act or omission on the part of the defendant. The law in respect of this has been clarified in the case of R v Adomako (1994) 3 All ER 79 where a four stage test for gross negligence manslaughter known as the Adomako Test was outlined by the House of Lords:

The test involves the following stages:

a) the existence of a duty of care to the deceased;
b) a breach of that duty of care which;
c) causes (or significantly contributes) to the death of the victim; and
d) the breach should be characterised as gross negligence, and therefore a crime.
http://www.cps.gov.uk/legal/h_to_k/homicide_murder_and_manslaughter/#voluntary

Murder and manslaughter are both common law offences and both have a maximum life sentence.

In this case a charge of manslaughter is appropriate because it would be very difficult to prove that the mother deliberately starved her child with the intention of causing him to die.

[hc4361]

Pixie, unintentionally causing death could be 'accidental death' or 'death by misadventure'.

[andy-hughes]

Two words - diminished responsibility - a legal term that sums up another tragic death.

[pixie373]

Ah, hc. I thought those two terms were when someone caused their own death, but not suicide.

[jim360]

Murder is harder to prove. Indeed pressing for that charge might well end up with the mother being found not guilty. Though, hopefully, guilty of the lesser offence of manslaughter. It's a vile and sickening crime. But the best bet is to ensure that the woman does receive punishment for her crime. I think that will be served best here by a charge of manslaughter.

[Zeuhl]

/Though, hopefully, guilty of the lesser offence of manslaughter. /

I'm not sure it works that way; can a failed prosecution for murder 'slip' into a manslaughter conviction