Double Firsts

[brainiac]

I keep reading/hearing about well-known people who got double firsts at Oxford or Cambridge: David Baddiel (English), Lily Cole (History of Art) and, I think, James Norton (Theology) at Cambridge. Could somebody please explain the difference between a double first and an ordinary (!) first. Are 'Doubles' only given at Oxbridge? Hey, one of you ABers out there might have one of these mysterious Doubles!

[Jackdaw33]

If you study two subjects at honours level, e.g. French and German, and get a first in both it is called a double first. The amount of study required for both subjects is reduced so the overall workload remains the same.

[brainiac]

Just looked them up: James Norton 'only' got a First in Theology; Tom Hiddleston (The Night Manager) got a Double First in Classics. I'm more intrigued now......

[brainiac]

Thanks, Jack, I see that could be the case with French and German, but how do you get a Double in, say, History of Art, or Classics? Is it 'just' a really, really good First?

[Jackdaw33]

Theology is a single subject. Classics consists of Latin and Greek so he got a first in both.

[jim360]

I thought that a double first was when you had also got a First in your first/ second year as well. I think that's what it means at Cambridge, anyway, where the full course is called the "Tripos" and split into parts I (first and second year) and II (third year); Masters in this system are part III.

[brainiac]

I think that makes sense, Jim, and explains how you can get a Double in a single subject like History of Art. Is it just at Oxbridge?

[Jackdaw33]

I think it's only an Oxbridge term. At Durham it was called joint honours, so a first in those would be the equivalent of a double first.

[jim360]

I think that meaning at least is only at Oxbridge. Not sure other universities do the same, either because lower-year exams count equally towards the overall degree or because they're regarded as merely ways to get into the second/ third year rather than as a graded thing in their own right.

Also Oxbridge is weird like that; I'm still waiting to collect my MA (Cantab.) for no other reason than enough time having passed since leaving...

[Jackdaw33]

It's over 40 years ago now, but at Durham you were only only examined at the end of the first year (called preliminary honours). If you failed you were taken off the honours course and put on the general degree course(now defunct) where you studied 3 subjects in much less depth. Finals were at the end of the third year, there were no exams at the end of the second year.

[brainiac]

Jim, is that to do with Oxbridge saying you could now 'convert' your BA to an MA? Think I read something about that a while back

[Jackdaw33]

You are right. At Durham first year exams did not count to the overall degree; they only gave you the right to proceed further. To get an MA at Oxbridge you only have to wait four years after graduating and pay a fee. No further study or exams required.

[jim360]

Yeah, that's the one. It's a bit silly but hey, you get to put on some fancy robes and go back to Cambridge/ Oxford again, and generally enjoy pretending you're a part of the establishment...

[jim360]

Oh and, *** -- Lily Cole matriculated at the same time I did, in the same college, and we did meet on our first day. I did that slightly bratty thing of pretending I had no idea who she was when introducing myself... hopefully she's forgotten that by now.

[jim360]

How is "sodd it" censored?

[Jackdaw33]

In Scotland the first degree for science students is B.Sc. whilst for arts students it it M.A. Odd, or what?

[brainiac]

Must be quite strange for James Norton to be playing a vicar in Grantchester, (shot mainly in Cambridge) when he studied Theology at Cambridge. Bet he could never have guessed that when he graduated - maybe Tom Hiddleston will get a part in something set in ancient Rome or Greece!

[Peter Pedant]

well Jack may have been 'up' in the good old days of the little go and the great go
yeah you know like 200 y ago

Jim n I were in the late twentieth century system where simply put you read a part 1 in two years and were classed ( first etc ) and then the third year was a part 2 ( another chance at a first )

and if you got a first in both part 1 and part 2 then you got a double first

lots and lots of exceptions - I read a part 1 in natural sciences and then a part 1 in Law. three years - two-year part one and a one-year part one - and your degree is in your final year subject so I got a law degree

Jim plugged in at post grad level and did a part 111 - eek !

he would be contemporary with math geeks who were so good at adding
that they took the second year math exam in their first year ( part one ) and then the final year in their second year ( part two ) and then in their third year the post grad MMath - in my time they still came out with a BA

In the good old days you could read a subject like history of art or sewing AND a math degree at the SAME time ! and if you got a first in both subjects at the same time you got a double first. Incredible
Lew Kwan Yew did it apparently in 1956 in Law and Math

Oxford well you did ask you had to do three years in Schools - and you could not chop and change as we could. So for Biochem - it was three years hard graft in Biochem - O I say ! - and it all boiled down to your third year and you could be asked any question relevant to any year. eek !
You were examined every year in classed exams and they had funny names just like in Money College Oxbridge episode of the Young Ones.
Prelims, Honour Mods and I cant recollect the final year one - I wasnt there.

And if you got a first in one of the first two years
but not in finals could you go around boasting you got a first at Cambridge ? O my god the fur used to fly over that one in my time ....

James Norton - Theology - first in part 1 and first on part 2 - easy one
and correct name - at Oxford I think it is called Divinity

Baddiel would have done an English part 1 and part 2 - but neednt - he could have done a history part one or law ( so long as you clock up three years )

Longish answer but you asked

[Peter Pedant]

oops sorry Jim I thought you had done a degree somewhere else....

My nephew told me that getting a masters was now NOT a question of waiting three years and paying £25 - and I had an MA cantab and now it was MA Camb- so you could tell the difference

[brainiac]

Blimey, Peter, I seem to have stirred up some memories there! I 'only' have an MA from a Scottish university, but, hey, I was only 19 when I graduated. Would have loved to have gone to Oxford or Cambridge, though

[Peter Pedant]

Oh i got my a levels at 16 !
quite a few of us around
mr brown ( the prime minister ) of kirkcaldy academy did apparently and has spent the remainder of his black and worthless life saying he felt abused as result of being hot housed

history boys is all about young men being hot housed for the seventh term oxbridge exam

did two years gap as a lab tech at porton down