Capital punishment?

[mariner2]

Please lets bring it back!
I understand the main argument of its opponents, a possible wrongful verdict and the terrible consequences of that, but what about when there is ABSOLUTELY no doubt?
(I know someone will say there can never can be a 100% watertight case, but I disagree)
What I don't understand from the antis is the way they can highlight cases from years ago of miscarriages of justice (largely because of all the publicity these cases atractt in the form of books and films) but completely ignore the people that have been murdered by criminals that have been released after serving a "life" sentence for murder.
Since this country abolished the death penalty the murder rate has doubled and there have been 75 people murdered by released killers, but curiously no books or films about any of them.
Will any of you that think capital punishment is barbaric and uncivilised have a think about this please?

[pinkpoodle19]

Hmmm, and everyone's tax would be spent on medical care for rapists and killers.
It would be a pointless waste of money.

[mariner2]

Eh?

[jake-the-peg]

Note that the main reason that most of the examples are from years ago is that it takes years to get many of these cases overturned!

I think you ought to consider what you hope to achieve by re-introducing capital punishment. You seem to imply by quoting the murder rate that you think it would be an effective deterrant - yet the murder rate in the US makes that look pretty unlikely.

The murder rate did not immediately rocket up immediately after the death penalty was abolished so there's little reason to believe it would drop if it was reintroduced.

Violent crime has actually been falling since 1995 http://www.crimestatistics.org.uk/output/Page6 3.asp

In fact your risk of being a victim of violent crime is only 3.6% and way lower that if you're not a young man 16-24

And yet 17% of people are "very worried" about crime - I guess you're one of them.

So having had a think, I'd say it was unneccessary and would be ineffective.

[mariner2]

My reasons for reintroducing it would be primarily for justice.
A life sentence imposed now, even if it was life, is likely to be watered down to next to nothing in the future so there is no feeling of justice having been done for the families of the victim. Imagine how Mrs. Bennet, (the poor mother of one of Hindley and Brady's victims) felt as there were rumours of Hindley's release?

[jake-the-peg]

Tariff's or minimum sentences are often paraded by the press as the sentence someone gets - Whereas in fact it is the mimimum

The average life sentence prisoner actually is imprisoned for 14 years.

Hardly "next to nothing"

[mariner2]

Well, you see, I think that 14 years is a joke, and even if someone gets "life" tomorrow - 14 years - in 5 years time, a couple of different home secretaries have been and gone, and another one of them decides that prison is a bit on the harsh side and anyway, the prisoner hasn't killed anybody else since he's been locked up, so let's parole him a bit earlier to make room for some pensioner who hasn't paid her council tax.
There's always this possibility and there shouldn't be. . . . and what about the �2-3000 a week it takes to keep these people in the 3 star hotels we call prisons? Better spent elsewhere surely?

[joko]

you seem to be asking us all to change the law, as though we have some power in this issue...?

we can think about it all you like but the subject is not up for a vote

it will not solve anything - 75 people in about 45-50 years is not a lot compared to the average yearly murder rate

[Keeprockin]

In every case there found guilty there is ''no doubt'' otherwise they'd be found innocent.
I hope if it is ever brought back,someone near to you is innocently sentenced,son,grandchild then we'll see how you feel.
Miscarriages of justice are too commonplace in all aspects of crime. Life should mean life,which would also give the lifer a chance of new evidence appearing which could prove his/her innocence.

[mariner2]

joko - 75 people is not a lot?? So why are you worried about 3 or 4 wrongful executions then?
keeprockin - thanks so much for your kind constructive words, and yes I know that we don't have muder one, two and three like they do in the U.S. but we SHOULD have as there are obviously differing degrees of murder, for example 10 - victim serial killer vs one off crime of passion.
Shall I come down to your level and wish death at the hands of a released killer on one of you family members? I think not.

[tigerlily11]

The USA has the death penalty in many states and they still have a high muder rate.
When the death penalty existed here people still killed eachother so no whats the point. It doesn't work and brings us down to the killers level.
Its just not worth the possibility of getting it wrong how ever scant it becomes. The need is for a better and more effective justice system and for life to be life with no prarole and prison to be a place of punishment and not a holiday.

[mariner2]

OK, so you say we can't have the death penalty because of the possibility of wrongful execution and no matter how small that chance is it must not be taken.
In that case you must never drive your car again, as there is a chance of killing an innocent person with it, and you cannot take that chance however small.
We also have to ban air and train travel, and crossing the road and anything else where you have a miniscule chance of getting killed.

[pinkpoodle19]

Write to Tony Blair if you feel so passionate about it, see how far that gets you lol.

[mariner2]

Well, all you antis will get your way, and THIS is what it leads to - I've just heard that a 78 year old great grandfather died after being attacked by two drunken yobs when he reprimanded them for urinating on a supermarket wall. They stepped over him to go back into the supermarket to steal more alchohol and stepped over him when they came out.
Only one of them was found guilty and guess what he got ??
TWO F******* YEARS.
That's what lily-livered "justice" and pandering to scum gets you in this country.