Power of attorney

[Daij]

My mother suffers from vascular dementia and is in hospital at the moment. I was told that I had to get copies of her assessments in order to arrange care when she is discharged. Because mother does not have capacity I had to present my power of attorney documents to them so that they could give me the information.
They’ve had the documentation for a week and I requested its return because I have to present that document to other organisations for different reasons. I tried to pick it up earlier on and was presented with a photocopy of a photocopy of the original because the person who was in possession of it didn’t know where the original is.
Two questions;
1. Can people photocopy legal documents without permission from the owners to do so?
2. What is my next move if the original cannot be found?

[woofgang]

yes people can take photocopies of official documents without permission. If the hospital has lost your document, I would be asking THEM what THEY are going to do about the loss.
I am assuming as she lacks capacity, you have had to register the documents (old style) or get it officially registered as part of the original process. I would be going back to the Office of the Public Guardian, telling them what has happened and asking them how to proceed.

edit: yup, you go back to the OPG and they provide certified copies for a fee which o would be expecting the hospital to pay.

[woofgang]

link http://forum.alzheime...ing-Power-of-Attorney

[Barmaid]

Exactly what documents did you give them? (Sorry to be so pedantic, but the more precise you are the better). Was it an EPA or an LPA? Was it registered?

[dzug2]

The procedure should be that the organisation that requires to see the PoA takes a photocopy and returns the original to you. So yes they are entitled to copy it.

If they've lost it they should pay to replace it - not sure how easy that is these days

You should hope and pray that the other organisations you need to show it to will accept a photocopy.

[Hymie]

I believe that only the original is a valid (legal) document – copies will not be acceptable to other organisations.

I have my mother’s completed Lasting Powers’ of Attorney document pages safely stored within individual plastic pocket pages of a presentation folder. As yet, I have not had need to present the document(s) to any organisation, but would not let them out of my (direct) control – because of what can and has happened to you.

My advice to you would be to get confirmation in writing from the hospital that they have lost the original – I would imagine that you could then take legal action for any consequential losses that you and or your mother suffer as a result of their negligence. Given that this could have the potential to run into many thousands of pounds – once I had written confirmation that the original had been lost, I would seek professional legal advice as to what to do next.

[Hymie]

Damn – it looks like it will only cost you £100 or so, if woofgang is correct.

[Barmaid]

Before we assess the costs, I'd like to know EXACTLY which documents we are talking about since normally the originals are lodged with the PGO. Perhaps I am just too pedantic.

[Graham-W]

As Barmaid has said, the originals, if registered, are with the OPG. All you get back is a certified copy.
Further office (certified) copies can be obtained from the OPG. Can't remember the cost but you should be able to negotiate with the hospital who lost them for the payment.

[cathfromsaron]

hosle notorious at losing stuff!

if future i would provide a certified copy only (copies formally signed and dayted) so the original doesn't leave my grasp!

cath x

[Graham-W]

Office copy of a Lasting Power of Attorney £35
Office copy of an Enduring Power of Attorney £25

[Brimoan]

Hi Daij

My father suffers fron vascular dementia.
We jointly own the house we live in and at first the Social Worker said the house would live in would have to be sold to finance the fees.
This was totally wrong as I was over 60 and a joint owner.
I just threatened to involve a solicitor if my father did not get NHS funding and he got it before I even got to the solicitor.
This has also happened to several people in the home my father is now in.
I would say do not trust social workers.
I do not tink I am very popular with my local PCT or Social Services Department as I am passing this on.

[Brimoan]

Hi again Daij

Another thing I should mention is they did try to put me under pressure to pay even after NHS funding was agreed.
The social worker said my father had been in hospital for too long and several homes has assessed him but only after long period of time one would take him.
They then said funding would have to be approved and this could take weeks and the room could be gone in the mean time and he would get worse if he stays in hospital.
I just stood firm and he was in the home 2 days later.
The home is good and people are always passing away so it is never full.
I am now typing this in the house Social Services told me to sell and receiving Dad's state and occupational pension.
I am visiting him most afternoons and taking him a pie and a glass of wine and keeping him in decent clothes etc and will inherit the house in full when Dad passes away.

Factor30 and others.

I am sorry I have to mention this subject again but Daij may not have seen my posts.

[factor-fiction]

It's important to you- important enough for you to raise it at every opportunity under different names- but I can't see that it's relevant to Daij's post.
There may be a better forum for campaigning for what may be a worthwhile cause. Weren't you also posting on another forum for grandparents (I've forgotten the name)? Or have you taken it up with your MP?

[Brimoan]

Factor30

I think it is right Daij is told.
He could lose his inheritance if he is not.
I do not know if you inherited much but I think that people should not pay nursing home fees if they do not need to by law.

[Brimoan]

Oh

I have taken it up with my MP.

[factor-fiction]

No I have never inherited anything but if my mum goes in a home I would regard the house as hers and not as my (and my siblings') inheritance so if she wanted to sell it to make her life as comfortable as possible I would support her (although of course I'd make sure she checked that she was liable for payment). Besides, she will probably outlive me anyway- the women in my families tend to live 30 years longer than the men

[Barmaid]

Brimoan

1 You do not know that Daij is the beneficiary of his mother's estate - it could all be left to charity.
2 Please dont go "off topic" in law - it's difficult enough to help people without you chucking in red herrings all over the place.

[factor-fiction]

Sorry- I once got an eighth share of my grandmother's estate but she lived in a council flat.

[factor-fiction]

Sorry Daij- in trying to bring your thread back on track I seem to have diverted it further

[Daij]

Thanks to you all for contributing. The original document has now been found.