Employment law

[commonsense]

I have worked as a support worker at grade 4 pay scale for over seven years. Recently my employer advertised for a permanent manager post. I applied and was offered the job verbally on 16/09/12.
We verbally discussed hours, rota, roles etc
Start date was given as 26/09/12.

I started my new job. My manager sent off appointment form to HR outlining start date and permanent fixed position, hours etc

I then renegotiated salary as I wasn't happy with what was offered and past experience was taken in to account, therefore I have email logs of negotiation of salary.

Today I was told that the service is being redesigned and I will be entered in to the process as a grade 4 support worker. I disputed this and was told that my new job was only temporary. However all other applicants and advertisement show it as permanent.

It turns out that my crb is not valid and the appointment form does say that it needs to be valid before I start the new job. I found this out as did my manager after I had been in the new post for over ten days. My manager had said not to worry as I was already in post.

I need to know if legally I can fight the redesign and request that I be judged as a grade 5 manager, can I also take benefit of the three year pay protection plan promised to everybody .

Can I fight my case that the job was advertised as permanent and offered as permanent?

[woofgang]

Why was your crb not valid?

[commonsense]

It had expired in March and I didn't receive any renewal pack.

[commonsense]

But I have no convictions, it was an oversight. I've resubmitted the renewal request

[bednobs]

as far as i know, crb's dont expire, do they?

[furrypusscat]

I didn't know CRBs had expiry dates. Mine as voluntary Guide leader doesn't. Is it employment law then.

[bednobs]

a quick look tells me it's up to the organisation how often they want it renewed - my PCT don't care as such

[Maydup]

No they don't expire, but if a valid CRB was a condition of employment then they have every right to delay the appointment until its in place. Get it renewed and take it from there.

[woofgang]

Does your appointment documentation say temporary or permanent?

[commonsense]

Crb is valid for two years in my role as I was working with vulnerable adults when at grade 4.

I accept that appointment can be delayed but I've been doing the job since 26/09/12 so surely this should be taken in to account in the redesign?

Do I have a case that the job is permanent

[commonsense]

Appointment doc says permanent

[bednobs]

sounds like it

[commonsense]

Also original advertisement of Job says permanent

[commonsense]

I'm just so upset Like I've been stabbed in the back. Even my manager is shocked, the two men that interviewed me also said permanent

[furrypusscat]

Are you in a union, if so take copies of everything and get in touch with them. Don't let go of any original documentation. Sounds like you have a good case.

[furrypusscat]

If not in a union, do you have legal assistance on your home insurance cover. Contact them and see what your legal rights are. They may be able to advise or even take up your case for you.

[plautus]

Nor knowing what a "support worker" is, nor in which field you are employed, it is difficult to conceive any meaningful advice.

[buildersmate]

The out of date CRB is irrelevant to the main points of your question, but the usual suspects tend to pick on the bits they do know about, rather than try attempting answers to the critical questions.

It sounds like you attempted to renegotiate your salary with someone who didn't have the authority to agree such matters, and the organisation is attempting to cover its tracks by now saying the role is not permanent. That way the organisation is not taking on a permanent obligation to grade uplift - many organisations have numbers of roles at certain levels fixed for them by more senior (HR, typically) people to prevent such gradual grade drift.

Of course the offer should have been put in writing - indeed I wouldn't have accepted it til it was, but that shouldn't disadvantage you now.

I think you've tried to pull a fast one by trying to renegotiate after the job was accepted - albeit verbally - and I think you will have to back-off the Grade 5 demand.

I don't have a clue what you mean by 'pay protection plan' unless you are referring to protection given to redeployed staff to red-ring at the current salary. I think you are pushing your luck with this one - it needs a decent HR Manager in there to sort it out.

[factor-fiction]

I think that you may be able to sort this out with HR/your manager initially- maybe there has been a misunderstanding. However I can see that they may try to stick to their guns if it was made clear in any offer letter that it was conditional upon your CRB being up-to-date and would be temporary/provisional in the meantime. If an initial meeting/exchange doesn't sort it out quickly then i would involve the union and/or raise a grievance.
Hopefully buildersmate will see this and be able to advise

[commonsense]

I work in day care services with adults for the local council. I was a support worker to vulnerable people but applied for the position of manager and was offered/started the role

I thought I was in the union but they said I had not paid the last twO month subscription cost, I paid it with my card and I can get legal advice tomorrow. I just wanted to be mOre informed, as some union reps can be poor!

[factor-fiction]

As I hoped, buildersmate has seen this now. I have quickly read buildersmate's note and I generally agree although I understood that the new job was always going to be grade 5 and what you negotiated was a higher salary within grade 5. I'm also not sure about what was confirmed in writing- in a later post you say the appointment docs says PERMANENT