Scotish Tuition fees mystery

[modeller]

Scotland has been told that because Scottish students don't have to pay Uni-Tuition fees then they must allow EU students in free otherwise it would be discrimatory. If that is so why should UK students have to pay in Scotland . I thought we were in the EU. All their thousands of rules which they churn out and we have to obey why is this one different ?

[rov1100]

The Scots have always despised the English. They are quite happy to receive extra funds with the Barnett formula from England. They complain forever we are taking their oil but most of the gas fields were not in their sector. If they want idependence let them get on with it and then maybe we could charge the full amount for Scots students who want to study in England.

[thedaveformula]

@rov1100 That's a very vitriolic statement on scottish people. I don't see in Scotland any particularly evident anti-English sentiment, other than in sport. Have you even BEEN here?

[modeller]

Some of this may be true but legally can they apparently discriminate against , the UK , on this matter. ?

[joeluke]

The Scots are happy enough to take our money, but also take the p!$$ by making rules to suit their own

[alexanderd]

modeller, noone seems to want to answer your question, just try to be funny but, in my opinion, it would be discrimination but I am not a legal eagle!

[DTCwordfan]

Never mind the gas fields we have a good chunk of the oil too......1st of all the dividing line is taken at the angle of the border extended out - so thats a good chunk of the N.Sea, plus that when this question of independence came up some years ago, the Shetlands and Orkneys indicated a preference to stay with England Wales and N.Ireland......and if we didn't want them to go to Norway. So draw the line of the border on that and it knocks out a good sector of the North Sea up against the Atlantic and where current exploration is.

And I would suggest we get our subsidies of RBS and BoS etc back....

[jake-the-peg]

Perhaps nobody in England has yet got off their ar$e to take them to the EU court over the matter

[ludwig]

That's a bit racist Jake.

[ludwig]

ooooOOOOOOOoooooooo. That's a bit racist steve.

[modeller]

I would suggest if the NUS spent their money on taking the Scots to the EU court rather than vandalising public buildings which their parents have paid for , they would get a verdict which would be worth millions to their members. I say 'would get' because the court has already ruled that Scotand is guilty of discrimination against all EU students . So Scots must allow all in free of charge or none.

[modeller]

I've found this extract which is of relevance .

// But under a quirk of European law and the UK's system of devolved government, English students are not able to attend for free because they are regarded as citizens of the same member state as Scotland – the UK.//

If this is true then we in the UK are citizens of Scotland and therefore should go to their Unis free if Scottish students do so.

[modeller]

The rest of the article is here :
http://www.guardian.c...numbers-soar-scotland

[THECORBYLOON]

Have a look here and you will see the EU has looked at the so-called "unlawful" treatment http://www.europarl.e...6/576358/576358en.pdf

[DTCwordfan]

To be fair to the Scots, they have been debating to bring in charging.

[eyethenkyew]

So, what about the Scots, say, living in England for donkey's years, paying their way, their taxes, contributing to the economy? There are quite a few, just as there are many English folk living in Scotland nowadays, paying their way too of course?

Does that mean that the England based Scot with England born kids going to Glasgow Uni in Scotland would need to pay whereas their Scotland based English counterparts with their Scotland born kids going to St Andrews Uni wouldn't?

Phew! Complicated this cross-border squabbling, ain't it?

[cassa333]

Eyethenkyew,

Yes I think that is how it goes.

If I have it right it isn't your nationality that counts its your home location. You have to live in an area for x time to be eligable.

I understood it to be similar to the post code lottery in the NHS. Just move to the area you want to have treatment/study.

Mind you I could be totaly wrong and it is purely done on mational heritage.

[mike11111]

This appears to be one of the inevitable consequences of devolution, a case of wanting to have one's cake and eat it. I am not anti-Scottish (or anything else for that matter) but it seems to me that there are only two realistic options, either total independence with full financial responsibility for its own government, or full integration into the UK as envisaged by the Act of Union, 1707. I suspect that if the former ever came about, as some advocate, they would soon be screaming to be let back in. It is true to say that the other constituents of the UK were coerced into union with England for historical reasons, mainly defence of the realm. Since the advent of modern technology that argument no longer holds good , and there is no reason why Scotland, Wales and NI should not become fully independent, as this can cause no harm to England and indeed might relieve the strains upon the English budget. How each would fare under such an arrangement is, of course, a different matter.

[eyethenkyew]

mike11111,

I was just about to close my computer down + go to bed when I noticed your response: The most significant bit in it is where you refer to "the strains upon the English budget." Which one might that be? Is there such a thing presently called an "English budget"?

I do not ask to be controversial, and I admit that the present set-up is complicated to most lay people, myself definitely included, but apart from the 3 devolved budgets, are you saying that on top of that, Scotland, Wales and N.I. are somehow getting hand outs, or a share of, what's meant to be England only money? That's what is sounds like? How exactly does that work? Because I, perhaps wrongly, assumed that anyone in the U.K., notwithstanding devolved budgets, were still entitled to certain other U.K. government controlled finances, i.e. defence budget (and others)? According to my reading of your post, though, it sounds as though only England should be entitled, hence the other 3 countries are dependent on English generosity?

Does that mean that as someone living in England, and of course a taxpayer, I'm paying over the odds to generously and heavily subsidise the other 3 countries?

Off to bed but I'll check up later today, if you feel like responding of course? Cheers.