Speeding question

[SteveSxx]

When someone is caught speeding by a group of local vigilantes with a handheld speed camera - does a police officer have to be present at the time ?

[Panic Button]

I don't think they have the power to do anything at all.

If they stopped you I doubt if you could do much about it though. They are just relying on the fact that it will stick in your mind and you will go slower through their village next time.

[johnny37]

Civilians do not have the right to operate a speed gun which can be used to prosecute you, even if a police officer is present. There was a recent case where the police took someone to court because they had set up a dummy speed camera box in their garden. As Panic Button says, they are probably just makling a point.

[Grunty]

If johnny37 was right, there would be no speed cameras. Committees, which usually have a nominal police involvement, now operate mobile and static speed cameras. It is unlikely that the vigilantes would acquire evidence of the quality required in court, but in theory it could be used, although they would probably require police assistance with such matters as the calibration of the cameras. I can't see the police being enthusiastic about receiving a heap of information from the vigilantes that they were then expected to sort out and use for a prosecution. Thankfully, I have not seen these vigilantes for some time. In trying to make their point, which is sometimes invalid, some cause more danger to themselves and road users than the speeding does.

[SteveSxx]

The reason for this question is that I was doing 35 in a 30 limit on Friday evening and had my reg taken by a group of these vigilantes with a hand held gun - I am the first to admit to doing wrong but there was no polic officer with them (There has been in the past) - they hide behind a wall - and pop out - will they claim that there was a police officer with them ?

[Toureman]

You will not be sent a NIP, you might get a warning letter from the police which does not mean anything.

Some police forces are doing this just to frighten drivers.

[sarnieken]

Any speeding convictions have to be backed up by certified and tested euqipment operated by members of the constabulary you are caught in (might be slightly out by the constabulary but I'm reasonably sure).

If they did zap you with a laser unit they have to prove that it was mounted correctly, that it had been recently calibrated and that it was your car they zapped. That's why everything is done with video these days.

[SteveSxx]

Whatever it was that zapped me was handheld anyway - not mounted in a van / tripod or anything - so I hopefully am safe - a woman standing with them was scribbling things (reg numbers ?) down in a notebook too
Perhaps I should sue them for breaking the privacy laws if they do write to me, otherwise how will they find my address ?

[mortalman]

these "Community Patrols" are set up 1st to deter speeding, but mainly so that the village came show that the main road through their village is being used by cars going too fast. If the partol makes a note of your number it can be passed onto the police for info purposes, (a sort of petition) I've heard of some counties introducing yellow and red card systems. first and second warning etc.

[dusty1]

The only people that should be able to access your address from your reg No is the police or ministry of transport, so if you do get a letter or anything from the vigilanty group, it would be worth looking into, and if they have there address on the letter, send them a reply from your solicitor, warning them that you might take them to court for breach of privacy or something of that order.

[SteveSxx]

Yesterday I received through the post WHAT I CAN ONLY DESCRIBE AS A COMMERCIAL VENTURE - Trying to sell me vehicle security devices via two companies who should know better than being involved in this SCAM
The letter starts with the fact that I hsad been monitored by the community speed watch team travelling at 36 mph in a 30 mph zone but No Further action would be taken on this occasion - But if I am seen speeding again - I face the full wrath of the vigilantes ?

I guess because the CSW people have no legal rights to do anything
Then the letter goes on to try to sell me security devices

I AM DUMBFOUNDED

[johnny37]

If your address was obtained from the DVLA database to try and sell you something there is definitely a prob here. Take the letter to the police.

[dusty1]

Better still take it to the police, then a solicitor let him look at it and advise you, about how they got your address as I am sure the only people that can legaly get your address from your licence number via the D.V.L.A. are the police and ministry of transport, the first half an hour will cost you nothing, but could be very imformative, and you could end up prosecuting them wouldn't that be nice. plus the fact that sounds like a threat to me, IF YOU DON'T DO THIS I WILL DO THAT. is a threat, and the police will take a dim view of that I would think.

[pianoman81]

to all of you on this thread-

next time those vigilantes pop out,
just clip them with your wing mirror as you go past-
it will cost you a replacement wing mirror,
but believe me it is worth it ...... >:)

i did it last week to one and i was laughing all day long-
i had to pay �69 for a new mirror but it was easily worth it >>>>>>>
wanna be police officers who are too fat , unfit or old to join the force.
want to have a bit of authority and are a bit narcissistic...

hilarious though ....... >:)

[Panic Button]

Dusty, the DVLA sell your detailsat �2.50 a time to any company that can show they have a reasonable reason to have it. How do you think all those private parking enforcement companies are able to contact the owners of cars they are fining?

[SteveSxx]

My letter was addressed from the POLICE CHIEF INSPECTOR though - despite the fact that they were not there at the time !!

[Toureman]

If your letter was signed by a genuine Police officer he is legally skating on very thin ice, I should have a word with one of the daily papers, they are very interested in this sort of intimidation and exploitation.

[SteveSxx]

I will do and will post the results here OK

[merlin58]

Its just 'sabre rattling' They cant do anything at all.

Next time just give them the finger and a smile as you go past. (As long as there is no coppers around)

(And dont speed)

[johnny37]

To get back to the original question I read in my Telegraph Saturday about the police training more vigilante groups. Apparently the information given by them to the police cannot be used to prosecute you BUT the first time you will be sent a warning letter. The second time you will be sent another stronger warning and the police will come down to try and catch you the third time (or anyone else who happens to be speeding when the police are there). So the answer appears to be that you cannot be prosecuted on information provided by a vigilante. It appears to be more of a deterrent than anything as the chances of you be caught the third time must be very small.

As regards the letter you received trying to sell you the security devices. I know the DVLA do give out addresses to some very dodgy companies (eg for parking) but i would still complain to the police about the letter you received. Whoever gave them your registration and/or address had no right to do so.

ps I hope you will now try to stick to the limit!

[johncas]

Best thing to do it keep to the speed limit if people keep speeding there and keep getting cought by these community speed watch people with hand held zappers then next thing you know the police will have there mobile speed camers there you know the camera in the back of a transit van where they can fine you. You get this where
I live you get these vigilantes with a handheld speed camera everyone is speeding then next thing police are there with speed camera van bringing in the money issueing loads of fines because they know everyone is speeding there