News2 mins ago
Ticket Touts Are ‘Classic Entrepreneurs’
Ticket touts are ‘classic entrepreneurs’ who should be allowed to operate without interference, says new Culture Secretary Sajid Javid http://
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Obviously Mr Javid has no direct experience of touts, or he would not be making such outlandish statements. Touting exists at industrial levels, and the notion that touts are simply 'providing a service' is as facile and misleading as suggesting that heroin dealers 'provide a service'. In the strict meaning of the phrase, it is true, but that does not mean...
11:41 Fri 11th Apr 2014
Obviously Mr Javid has no direct experience of touts, or he would not be making such outlandish statements.
Touting exists at industrial levels, and the notion that touts are simply 'providing a service' is as facile and misleading as suggesting that heroin dealers 'provide a service'. In the strict meaning of the phrase, it is true, but that does not mean that it is valid or desireable.
So at the top end, we have virtual companies whose business is to buy up tickets and then sell them on at vastly inflated prices to fans of events who wer not successful in obtaining tickets which the touts have hoovered up by whatever machiavellian means they have so to do - as in the case of the Kate Bush concerts.
But there is also the individual touting trade which again Mr avid will have no knowledge of - nor will he since as of yesterday, his need to bother with the inconvenience of actually buying tickets for anything has vanihsed into the ether for the duration of his appointment.
As a music journalist, I attend dozens of concerts around the Midlands and North, and in London. I have yet to visit any major concert and not be accosted by any of a number of seriously dodgy characters who are hanging around shouting their willinginess to buy or sell tickets, as though they are market traders.
Standing on the fringes of these seriously intimidating individuals, will be bewildered members of the public who have one or two tickets they are trying to sell for face value for people unable to attend. These people are intimidated away from the venue's doors by the 'classic entrepreneurs' who probably do this as sideline to their drug business and government claims for incapacity benefits etc.
On the only recent occasion when i was in the position of disposing of a ticket - my plus-one guest was unable to attend - so I had one ticket at no cost to me, and was offering it free of charge to the first taker, i was physically threatened by the nearest 'classic entrepreneur' and my ticket remained unused.
This is another example of a government minister living the rarified life of an MP who knows nothing of which he speaks spouting utter garbage - I hope he is re-apprised of his attitude - i for one shall be writing to the minister to provide a little education from someone who has to dodge touts on a regular basis.
Touting exists at industrial levels, and the notion that touts are simply 'providing a service' is as facile and misleading as suggesting that heroin dealers 'provide a service'. In the strict meaning of the phrase, it is true, but that does not mean that it is valid or desireable.
So at the top end, we have virtual companies whose business is to buy up tickets and then sell them on at vastly inflated prices to fans of events who wer not successful in obtaining tickets which the touts have hoovered up by whatever machiavellian means they have so to do - as in the case of the Kate Bush concerts.
But there is also the individual touting trade which again Mr avid will have no knowledge of - nor will he since as of yesterday, his need to bother with the inconvenience of actually buying tickets for anything has vanihsed into the ether for the duration of his appointment.
As a music journalist, I attend dozens of concerts around the Midlands and North, and in London. I have yet to visit any major concert and not be accosted by any of a number of seriously dodgy characters who are hanging around shouting their willinginess to buy or sell tickets, as though they are market traders.
Standing on the fringes of these seriously intimidating individuals, will be bewildered members of the public who have one or two tickets they are trying to sell for face value for people unable to attend. These people are intimidated away from the venue's doors by the 'classic entrepreneurs' who probably do this as sideline to their drug business and government claims for incapacity benefits etc.
On the only recent occasion when i was in the position of disposing of a ticket - my plus-one guest was unable to attend - so I had one ticket at no cost to me, and was offering it free of charge to the first taker, i was physically threatened by the nearest 'classic entrepreneur' and my ticket remained unused.
This is another example of a government minister living the rarified life of an MP who knows nothing of which he speaks spouting utter garbage - I hope he is re-apprised of his attitude - i for one shall be writing to the minister to provide a little education from someone who has to dodge touts on a regular basis.
selling tickets to gigs isn't the same as selling heroin, though. One is inherently illegal, the other not.
Touts are just capitalists who buy tickets in the hope of making a profit - but run the risk of losing their money if they judge the market wrong. Classic supply and demand stuff. If you don't like their chartges, don't buy.
Intimidation is another matter; but there are laws to deal with it.
Touts are just capitalists who buy tickets in the hope of making a profit - but run the risk of losing their money if they judge the market wrong. Classic supply and demand stuff. If you don't like their chartges, don't buy.
Intimidation is another matter; but there are laws to deal with it.
I don`t mind the touts that are outside venues - I have had excellent tickets from them but they only tend to sell a few tickets. What I hate are the touts that buy up all the online tickets the minute they go on sale and then put them on Ebay at an inflated price. They deny real fans the chance to see their favourite bands and I`m sure the government could do something about it but don`t bother. In the US, it is illigal to sell tickets above their face value and Ebay had to wipe all of the U2 tickets that were on there for one of their tours. The new Culture Secretary hasn`t got off to a very good start - he obviously has never tried to get tickets for the Rolling Stones or other big bands.
Booldawg and jno have hit the nail squarely on the head. Nobody is forced to buy concert tickets;going without seeing a show is not life-threatening. Simply don't buy the tickets, let them get their fingers burnt a few times and things might change. But it does not matter if they do not.
Aside from intimidation (which is illegal and should be dealt with) buying and selling tickets is no different to buying and selling shares. Somebody has them, somebody else wants them and they strike a trade at an agreed price. You pays your money (or not, as the case may be) and takes your choice.
Aside from intimidation (which is illegal and should be dealt with) buying and selling tickets is no different to buying and selling shares. Somebody has them, somebody else wants them and they strike a trade at an agreed price. You pays your money (or not, as the case may be) and takes your choice.
I don`t agree NJ. Maybe you aren`t interested in "pop concerts" but it is quite upsetting to not be able to get any tickets at all for someone you really want to see. How would you feel if you wanted to buy (for eg) an airline ticket that was £500 but you could only get it from a supply and demand tout for £800? These people make it impossible to get tickets as they crash the websites as soon as they go on sale.
well, that's a test of how much you want whatever it is, 237SJ. Do you want it £500-worth? £700-worth?
Sometimes even if you really want to see a band, you just can't.
If mass buying of tickets is a problem, cant the seller deal with it? They managed to do so for the Olympics despite having an incredibly shambolic booking system.
Sometimes even if you really want to see a band, you just can't.
If mass buying of tickets is a problem, cant the seller deal with it? They managed to do so for the Olympics despite having an incredibly shambolic booking system.
Not everyone can afford to pay £1000 to see Kate Bush jno. It`s not really a test of how much you want to see someone. An affordable price is set by the artist, promoter and venue (in booking fees). Touts are just unofficial persons taking advantage of that. I might be wrong but I think it`s illegal to charge over face value for football tickets - I don`t see why it can`t be the same for music concerts. The government could do something about it, but don`t.
I can't afford to pay £1000 to see Kate Bush, let alone £100,000 for a second-hand Lamborghini. So I just go without.
Deprivation may not be good for the soul, but it doesn't kill you. If the promoters want to insist nobody has more than two tickets, and that only the original buyers can use them (as the Olympics people did), it's possible. I suspect they're not really bothered enough, though.
Deprivation may not be good for the soul, but it doesn't kill you. If the promoters want to insist nobody has more than two tickets, and that only the original buyers can use them (as the Olympics people did), it's possible. I suspect they're not really bothered enough, though.
require that there should be no more than two tickets per credit card; I think that was how the Olympics worked. (I don't know how many cards your average tout has.)
I'm not trying to defend the market economy; I think it prioritises money and punishes those without. Still, that's what we've got and a lot of people love it - usually those with the money.
I'm not trying to defend the market economy; I think it prioritises money and punishes those without. Still, that's what we've got and a lot of people love it - usually those with the money.
I have some sympathy with the idea. Never really saw why there was so much fuss in a capitalist society because someone bought at one price and wishes to find someone willing to buy at a higher price. It's not like they are flogging something folk can not refuse. Don't buy from them and they'll soon stop. Fans only have themselves to blame.
I'd really like to buy some EasyJet shares at a tenner a pop. But I cannot because somebody else has snapped them all up and they now trade at about £17. Same thing.
If the problem occurred with airline tickets (which I do buy quite a few of) as you suggest, 237, I'd either pay up or not travel. It's quite simple. Travelling for me is not a must-have. It's something I like to do but would not pay silly money to do it.
The answer to this is for all fans to simply refuse to buy them. Touts get burnt, artists play to empty venues, something will get done. But that won't happen.
If the problem occurred with airline tickets (which I do buy quite a few of) as you suggest, 237, I'd either pay up or not travel. It's quite simple. Travelling for me is not a must-have. It's something I like to do but would not pay silly money to do it.
The answer to this is for all fans to simply refuse to buy them. Touts get burnt, artists play to empty venues, something will get done. But that won't happen.
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