Muslims And Jerusalem

[Khandro]

As there is absolutely no mention of Jerusalem in the Koran, why do Muslims, despite a Jewish presence there for 3,000 years, think they have any claim whatsoever to it?
Only recently are books appearing attempting to create a connection by deceit and fabrication;
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2012/02/muslim-scholar-explains-why-jerusalem.html

[TWR]

Why the hell can't people get on with each other instead of fighting over dam religion / Boarders, I often wonder if there's a bloke "up stairs" why dose he allow all this killing / ill feeling to continue.

[mikey4444]

Khandro...Islam was only invented in about the 7th Century, so it is never going to be able compete with Judaism. But surely the point is that its about whats going on now, not 3000 years ago.

[Gromit]

Basically Roman Chiritianity superceded The Jews in Israel in the third century, and they didn’t get it back until the middle of the 20th century.
So it is rather disingenuous to say they have been there for 3000 years.

Christians as well as muslims have holy sites in Jerusalem.
The claim that God gave Israel to the Jews rather falls down if you regard those holy books as fairy stories. The Arabs had it from the 7th century, and then the British briefly. Conquerers occupy and then stake claims to Sovereignty, be it the Romans, Arabs and British. But modern Israel wasn’t created from a conquest, it was gifted by the superpowers, and had been occupied by non jews as part of the Ottoman empire for centuries.

So yes, a claim based on the Quran is bogus, but the jews’ claim is equally bogus.

[Khandro]

grommit //So it is rather disingenuous to say they have been there for 3000 years.//
Jews don't say that they have been there uninterrupted for 3,000 years.

[naomi24]

A bit of a biased report there Khandro, but it’s your way so not unexpected. Ignoring the fact that Islam ruled Jerusalem for generations with the Jews out of the picture until the middle of the 20th century, Islam was founded on Judaism with a bit of Christianity thrown in for good measure. Mohammed was a wily old merchant who, when writing the Koran, attempted to address all eventualities, and with the subsequent help of supporters who were, and still are, eager to duck and dive around the contents of that original scrap of a book, pretty much succeeded. Putting it simply Islam high-jacked virtually every aspect of Judaism including its prophets. It too traces its history back to Adam and, furthermore, claims to pre-date Judaism. Hence, with its belief in Mohammed as the final prophet there is, therefore, no more to be said. All of that, in Islam’s estimation, supersedes any other entitlement and justifies its right to claim Jerusalem for itself.

Leaving religion aside, morally the Palestinians who have occupied the land we now know as Israel for well over 1000 years have been treated abysmally but that said I would far rather the Jews retain Jerusalem and Israel than for either to fall to Islam.

Despite all its perceived ‘holiness’ Jerusalem is one of the saddest places on earth. So much for ‘holiness’.

Oh that we could rid the world of the blight on the planet that is religion!!

[Khandro]

naomi//Palestinians who have occupied the land we now know as Israel for well over 1000 years//
For 'Palestinians' I think you can read 'Arabs', there is no such thing as a Palestinian language or culture.

[naomi24]

Arabs, yes : Palestinians(those who reside in the area known as Palestine) : yes. What's your point?

[dannyk13]

Until 1948 Jerusalem was the capital of Palestine. That is the claim the Muslims have.

[Khandro]

naomi; //What's your point?//
My point could be encapsulated in the question, 'Can you name a famous Palestinian?'

[naomi24]

Khandro, If you google you’ll find a few – but what does that have to do with your question?

[dannyk13]

FAO.Khandro:-

https://www.google.co.uk/search?ei=SLkvWvzLNOXagAaZ8pGADg&q=famous.palestinians&oq=famous.palestinians&gs_l=psy-ab.12..0i13i30k1l10.32474.41761.0.46668.9.9.0.0.

[anotheoldgit]

Gromit

/// The Arabs had it from the 7th century, and then the British
briefly. ///

Shouldn't that be the English?

Yes there once was a country called England, although one doesn't hear much about it these days, except when it is attached to sport.

[jno]

aog, no, it was the British. The Zionists drove them out with a terrorism campaign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing

[Khandro]

danny; Ha ha, that's quite a list, like at the top; Ms Lila Abu Lughod (of whom we never stop talking) professor of anthropology, women and gender studies, born in the 50s in the US !
I like the first one on the lower, 'Pre Mandate' list best.

[naomi24]

Khandro, I ask what this has to do with your question. Any chance of an answer to that? You seem to be going off at a tangent - again.

[Khandro]

naomi // Am I now supposed to answer my own question?
and while we're "off tangent", as you put it, Rod Liddle on Palestinians;

“Perhaps it is my suggestion that many Muslims are not favourably inclined towards Jews that provoked my suspension from the[Labour] party.
“Or perhaps it was my assertion that if the Palestinians were given Israel they would turn it very quickly into Somalia before you could say Yom Kippur, that enraged these new commissars.”

[naomi24]

Khandro, no, you’re supposed to answer my question. I don’t know what Ron Liddle’s opinion on Palestinians has to do with your original question either. It’s difficult to keep track of what you’re talking about with you jumping from one thing to another.

[ABerrant]

'Can you name a famous Palestinian?'

Have you not heard of Goliath?

[Khandro]

ABerrant, Sure! he was a Philistine and David was an Israelite - which kinda proves my point. :0)

[naomi24]

Khandro, I'm still wondering what your point is. Care to explain?