Safe Booze limit, complete rubbish it seems..

[R1Geezer]

http://www.timesonlin...nk/article2697975.ece
I just watched QI and they said that the lowest mortality rates are in those drinking 21-30 units and to have the same mortality as a teetotaller a man would have to drink 63 units! I managed to find the above Times article and it seems that is the case. Apparently they just made up the 21 limit! Why the subterfuge? Sqad, what's your take on this? My last drink was Saturday, all this abstaining is damaging my health, still, Friday tomorrow, cheers!

[ummmm]

I also think it's a subterfuge...

I had this argument with DT before. I don't think it's so much how much you drink....it's how you drink.

I was brought up in an Irish pub.....we had the same customers in everynight straight from work. They drank till closing time.....some of these customers would be in their 60's now and still going strong....They look like Sugar though....

I know people who have drank the same amount who have ate really well and lived a more active life....they look well...

I think much of it comes down to how you care for yourself outside of your drinking times...

I'm sure sqad will disagree with me....but this is my experience....and these are the people I know.

(I know other people as well)

[Gromit]

You take the word of an intellectual leftwing turd-burglar over the wisdom of the BMA?

[jno]

I think you may have missed the faintest hint of parody there, birdie

[Answerprancer]

My take on this is:
If it *feels* like it's doing damage (mental or physical) it probably is.

I took a three month break from the old sauce and this is what happened...

Weeks 1/2: Struggles (quite hard) until about 1am before falling asleep.

One month: Some yearnings but not unbearable - noticable improvements in mental agility/sharpness during the day.

Two months: same as above.

Two and a half months of total abstinence: old (bad) sleep patterns creeping back in again, mental agility/sharpness the same, yearnings the same.

Three months: back to drinking about the same as before ie. sod it.

Conclusion: though I'm back to drinking WAY over the supposed safe weekly limit and I accept I have some mild dependency, I don't *feel* that I am doing myself any serious damage.

Personal figures:
Height: 5' 6"
Weight: about 10 st
Evening intake for me (starting from about 10pm) - approx 12 units.

[Quizmonster]

I gave this information a couple of weeks ago in a News question about the suggestion that over-65s should have no more than about half a pint of beer a day. At the time, I could not access the link we now have.
http://www.theanswerb.../Question1030277.html
Sadly, despite all sorts of subsequent information, the nonsensical 21 units concept is now "carved on tablets of stone" in most medical minds.

[emmie]

Most doctors seem to go with the idea of moderation, as in all things.

[Quizmonster]

Maybe so, Em, but try telling one you habitually drink 30 units of alcohol - that's about a daily couple of pints of beer - a week or that you believe 21 units represents a con!

[woofgang]

Yes the limits have no research basis but I think those TT versus high intake figures are a bit problematic in that they include alcoholics who no longer drink. I have never sen figures where the AWNLD are excluded from the TT figures

[Gromit]

The 2.5 units a day and the drive limit are the same. That is not a coincidence.

[woofgang]

How can that be Gromit? If I drink 14 units with my breakfast at 5 am then drive at 9.pm I would be clear to drive.

[jno]

Quizmonster, as you will know, "an alcoholic is a man who drinks more than his doctor".

[237SJ]

I think everyone`s got different tolerance levels and it`s hard to say but I remember Professor Roger Williams (George Best`s liver consultant) saying that he wouldn`t drink more than 6 alcoholic drinks a week. Boozers might say they feel alright and look alright but I bet if someone opened them up they would have a fatty liver at the very least.

[R1Geezer]

No gromit I don't take this over the BMA but QI do and I thought it's worth discussing, yes also the DD limit suspciously matches, mm

[ChuckFickens]

How can the DD limit match the claimed safe amount of units? they are entirely different types of measurements... the DD limit is a ratio (80 milligrams of alcohol per 100 millilitres blood) and the recommended daily amount is a fixed quantity.

[woofgang]

well at least there is one other sensible person on here Chuck :-)

[R1Geezer]

yes but the guidlines for what is safe to drink match the medical amount too. We all know that the DD limit is proportional but ask anyone how much they can drink and a "couple of pints" will be the answer. I know guy who drinks 5 pints of stella and drives regularly.

[woofgang]

that's public perception and depends on a ton of variables...contents of stomach, build of drinker (and ability to metabolise alcohol) time over which the alcohol is consumed, amount of alcohol in the beer and so on....the fact that people "think" that doesn't indicate any grand plan.

[Sqad]

Medicine in may ways is not an exact science and you could find a paper written in any medical journal to support or refute your on particular take on a topic.

If the medical profession are at odds with each other it means that they just don't know the answer.

Men 21 units of alcohol per week and women 14 units per week has been the baseline depending upon, in my opinion, doubtful data.

I don't know the answer to alcohol tolerance in relation to longevity...Frank Sinatra and Dean Martin seemed to have done all right despite having alcohol running through their veins most of the time.

Alcoholism however is a massive problem and a drain on the NHS as diabetes, liver disease and the overstretched Casualty Depts struggle to survive and this is due to the uncontrolled drinking of the young.

This has to be controlled and if subterfuge is the answer, then I am all for it.

For the general population I would advice....drink for pleasure and not for effect.

My post has't helped at all.............;-)